Trichocereus ID

[Paisano]

Hi, Ive been growing these peruvianoides for allmost a year. I purchased them from ebay. The seller listed 5 cuttings as authentic kk242 peruvian torhches and a potted plant as kk242 or glaucus (he was'nt sure). I purchased all of them. 9 month's later the potted plant is very different then the cuttings(now rooted). The rooted cuttings tend to be darker green with a very dark blue frosted overtone with new spines a redish brown color growing grey and dark brown with age. The potted plant is a light green with light blue overtones and with spines emerging as honey colored turning white then grey with age. Pictures are attached.

[Paisano]

here the pictures vertical.

[Evil Genius]

Yes im pretty sure thats what Knize sells as Trichocereus Glaucus. Whats the number again, KK336 right? Its a very nice plant. Dont think its really a Trichocereus Glaucus Ritter but its what Knize thinks it is.

[Paisano]

Hi and thanks for the input but there was no number with the multi armed plant. The seller also sells glaucus but i only have pictures of his glaucus for compare and this plant doesnt look like any of his glaucus pics either. Maybe Tarmaensis? I think it is very beautiful. They all are but this one is different. There are photos of two different plant there there. Three of the multi armed and two of the taged kk242.

[Evil Genius]

Ok lets sort this a little bit. The two pics with the endnumbers 17 & 18 show Trichocereus Glaucus KK336. With almost 100% certainty. Check out this link. http://sacredcactus.com/varieties_peru/KK336.jpg

Its the picture that knize posted on his webpage. Definately not Tarmaensis for this one. Please give me some more info about what picture shows what plant. What are the two that were labeled KK242?

Then theres this multiribbed potted one. I think it could be KK336 too but i would need to get a closeup to confirm that. If you posted one already, please tell me which one of the pics shows it.

The type of cactus show in the pics with the endnumbers 15, 16 looks diffrent and could be something else. Maybe even Tarmaensis but its hard to tell at this point because the cactus hasnt reached its full size yet. Tarmaensis has a very distinct long middle spine. Its extraordinarily long and your plants arent really there yet. It definately has similarity to a KK242 but that doesnt mean anything. It does not look like the typical KK242 Cuzcoensis that is around. I actually dont think its a KK242 but a very closely related one that Knize might be selling under the name KK242 too. There are many forms of them and all look totally diffrent. Knize doesnt bother to label plants right so you could basically have everything there. I will check some books later on. Maybe i can ID it.

[Paisano]

hi thanks for your interest. this rather complicated quickly..... umm ok so pic # 15 and #16 were sold as kk242 authentic (i bought 5 cuttings) pic # 17 #18 and #40 are the same plant that was sold as glaucus or kk242 but it does not resemble any of his kk242 i purchased or any of his gluscus identification pics. Ive been digging around trying to find what it could be as it resembles neither of the plants he said it was. Plants that he grows and sells!

Edited June 20, 2012 by Paisano

[Paisano]

i might ad that he despises Karl Knize identifications.

[Evil Genius]

Is he the guy from the link i posted?

Well, i think that what 17, 18 & 40 shows is definately Glaucus from Knize. I really love that plant and its one of my most favorite Trichos.

What 15 & 16 shows is definately related to KK242 somehow so i can see why he might have labeled them like that. You know, KK242 is more than Cuzcoensis. The problem is that so many plants and seeds were sold under that name that its getting hard to use one as a standard. Its even possible that your right and that its really Tarmaensis but i´ll have to check a few of my pics to know that for sure. I´ll be back.

[Evil Genius]

i might ad that he despises Karl Knize identifications.

Who doesnt?

[Paisano]

HAHAHA yes thats him! I was thinking the plant u have identified as glaucus was tarma. It is very striking. The spines are bright honey colored and the plant almost a lime green with baby blue overtones. The pics are not really showing the colors that well. It does not look like his glaucus pics (the guy from your link) but it does look like the Knize pic in your link that he has posted on his site. The 5 other kk242 (just like #15#16)plants all look the same and i refer to them as kk242 torches.

[Stillman]

Nice cacti loving the peruvianoids at the moment.

[Paisano]

ok i was looking at zircons (where i obtained these specimens) site and found this picture. Notice how the new spines are red to brown in both kk242 and glaucus. The multi armed plant that i posted pics of above has honey and cream colored new spines...... it arrived with a paper tag saying "kk242 or glaucus, I think???". it resembles the kk336 pic more than any of zircons glaucus pics but it still is not convincing as the spines are bright cream and honey colored.

Edited June 20, 2012 by Paisano

[shruman]

"i might ad that he despises Karl Knize identifications."

His ID's are not much better.

Probly worth also mentioning he personaly despises Trout aswell as his ID's.

The guy is a fugging nutter.

Nice looking peruvianoids.

Edited June 20, 2012 by shruman

[Evil Genius]

Hi Paisano, if you ask me, the picture is highly dubious because it shows two very similar Peruvianoid plants without actually providing a KK number for the glaucus. I dont think the Glaucus is KK336. Its also not what is sold as Glaucus in Europe. The plant that is shown as KK242 is absolutely not the typical Cuzcoensis type plant that you would get when you buy a KK242. It has similarities to one form of KK242 but it certainly isnt what is understood as a typical KK242. You know, at a certain point knize sold like 6 types of KK242 and all were so diffrent its ridiculous. Personally, i wouldnt be surprised if they (left & right) are in fact the same type of cactus. What would also make me concerned about this pic is the fact that the guy doesnt seem to know his own plants very well if he is giving stuff away labeled as "KK242 OR Glaucus", which are in fact very diffrent plants. Or maybe he raised similar looking plants from seed batches that knize mixed up because he´s known for throwing all kinds of shit in his bags. I am under the impression that the guy you got them from seems to have problems telling them apart. What can be seen on this new pic is rather what you would get from knize labeled as Macrogonus. In fact, i got something very similar from Knize with a Macrogonus number. I dont really accept the name macrogonus so i would say both are Peruvanoid. Nothing more, nothing less. Peruvianus typical for certain parts of peru. And really, i dont see a difference between the plant on the left and the one on the right. The fact that the right one is a little bit more glaucous doesnt many anything. In fact, glaucousness and spine color are very variable. Never say never but i would be very very surprised if the plant on the right is in fact a KK336. It would be great to see a better pic to take a closer look.

Edited June 20, 2012 by Evil Genius

[Evil Genius]

The plant in this pic is a typical KK242 Cuzcoensis. http://www.ebay.de/itm/100-Samen-Trichocereus-Peruvianus-/320919416683?pt=S%C3%A4mereien_Zwiebeln&hash=item4ab849af6b

[Paisano]

"i might ad that he despises Karl Knize identifications."

His ID's are not much better.

Probly worth also mentioning he personaly despises Trout aswell as his ID's.

The guy is a fugging nutter.

Nice looking peruvianoids.

 

HAHA I was thinking the same thing. After reading his web site and buying his plants i was suprised one came with a tag that said "kk242 or glaucus, I think???" However the plant looks nothing like either of those plants even the way he identifies them! Looks most like the kk336 picture in my opinion. Hows that cuzco kk242 plant? Any black haired smoothish pachanoi's out there that you know of?

[Evil Genius]

Any black haired smoothish pachanoi's out there that you know of?

You mean on the Areoles? Its actually not the norm and most Trichos with dark felted areoles that you can find with google are in fact something else with a wrong label. But i´ve also seen some Pachanoi Hybrids that have indeed dark Areoles. You know, none of this stuff is written in stone and in genetics, almost everything is possible. If you create a hybrid, some genes can be dominant. And if you have a father with a very dominant gene for dark felted areoles, you might end up with a Pachanoi with lots of hair.

[Paisano]

i was reading some of trouts notes on trichocereus that says the white haired pachanois are USA bred and that authentic pachanoi as documented by (britton n rose?) has black hair. the hair he was speaking of was during flower budding.