smokable lsa's from common house plant!!!

[friendly]

Try chewing just a few Vocanga seeds for a nice lift.

No contraindications for V. africana that I know of, but that doesn't mean you won't find anyI don't know about. ; -).

We had 75 mg a/b extract resulting from 100g of

V. africana rootbark and smoked it betwen three people in several attempts.

The results indicated--by taste and ++ effect--that there was some t. or other, possibly 5-meo or dimitri. A larger dose as opposed to several small ones would most likely produce better effect, but that was all we had at the time and seeing as it was new we were being cautious.

[ 24. May 2005, 00:17: Message edited by: friendly ]

[t st tantra]

friendly and rev,did the effects differ somewhat from hbwr apart from the lack of side effects?

trout has a bit in his books on interactions.

one titbit was that the effects of triptamine could be increased by predosing with lsd,apparently even subthreashold doses are said to work.lsas work just as well.

anyhow where i'm going is this.......

if maoi will potentiate by 2to3 times

then maoi + lsas can potentiate by 3to4 times.

spider grass by itself is a mellow joy but add say an entheogen and its among the most potent of sacrements!

t s t .

[monkeyZ]

friendly:

More on HBWR:  The seed husk, when removed by filing it off with a nail file and snorted is extremely effective, requiring only the filings from one or two seed husks to obtain the effect.

so for maximum use of the resource, you could prepare just a couple of seeds, removing and keeping the coating, crush/mix/drink the seeds, then snuff the coating for the same effect as drinking several, but with less discomfort and greater effect... very very interesting.

[foolsbreath]

smoking 1-2 ground hbwr seeds has a definite psychomimetic effect, or so i've heard. could be some sort of oxidation reaction happening during heating?

[Fractalhead]

Yeah I've felt funny for a little while after accidently getting a nose full of husk powder while cleaning HBWR. Quite a subtle almost placebo effect. In fact, I could only describe the effects as either the mildest hallucinogen experience or the most psychedelic placebo experience i've ever had. To be honest it was too subtle for me to compare it to qualitatively with any oral HBWR reports i've read but definitely a dreamy maybe slightly visual feel. Also kind of stimulating and mood enhancing. Although, it was a beautiful night wasn't it, buddy - i had fun running around the field like a loony while gazing up at the stars thanks for reminding me guys...

[narayan]

There seems to be alot of doubt about spider grass so I thought i'd post what i've found.

When I was pulling the stems away from the petals from a large batch of spider grass I collected I noticed that after a few minutes of handling the material I was getting mild LSA/LSD type effects such as breathing walls, slight CEV and a general not quite sober feeling.

When one cone of dried spider grass petals/buds (not sure what the technically term is for the part of plant i was smoking) is smoked it results in a foggy/hazy pyschdelic feeling which I attribute to the harmine alkaloids in the plant. This feeling lasts about an hour.

I've also tried using spider grass before taking mushrooms (P.subs) and cacti (T.Pachanoi).

When combined with mushrooms I smoked 1 cone of spider grass and ate half of what i'd usually take of mushrooms. This resulted in a very intense trip, probably one of the strongest mushrooms experiences i've ever had in fact. Repeated experiements led me to believe that spider grass potentiates mushrooms by atleast 3 times.

When combined with cacti I smoked 1 cone of spider grass and then at a relativley small amount of dried cacti powder. I wasn't really expected too much but was pleasantly suprised by the intensity of the trip. The alkaloids from the cacti also seemed to come on alot quicker than usual. Within 1 hour I was where i'd usually be at the 2-3 hour mark of a regular cacti experience. I also noted that the trip seemed to finish up quicker than usual, its possible that the cacti alkaloids where worked through my system quicker due to the spider grass. Although i've had much stronger experiences from cacti before this trip was very strong for the amount of cacti ingested.

I'm going to try spider grass + DMT later on this week so will posts the results after that.

[Fractalhead]

Certain members of the convolulaceae have been found to produce nortropane alkaloids (eg. calystegines) in the roots only. Could the smoking of roots be a clue? Personally, I'd be very suprised if the actives in convolvulaceae smoke were ergolines. Surely they would be disintegrated by the heat.

[Torsten]

Personally, I'd be very suprised if the actives in convolvulaceae smoke were ergolines. Surely they would be disintegrated by the heat.

This makes sense, but is probably wrong. I've smoked blotters with very interesting effects and one would assume this particular amide to be extremely sensitive to heat. Mind you the effect wasn't entirely like acid. It came in waves. Really intense waves for about 3 hours, every few minutes for about a minute or two, and almost entirely straight inbetween.

So I think smoking LSAs is plausible.

[apothecary]

T you've written about that a few times and I am very curious.

Can you do a more in depth writeup, or is there already one about? I searched for "smoking blotter" but found little.

[-YT-]

I had a little piece of Cactus resin on thursday about the size of a thumb nail,

30mins after i had complety dissolved the resin in my mouth I then proceeded

to smoke 3 cones of spider grass which did have a definate affect a little more

pronouced affects from the cactus and a warmish body feeling much like HBWR

seeds. The cactus resin was only a small amount but a definite boost you could say

from the spider grass. looking forward to further experiments with larger doses,

will post results in the near future.

[Torsten]

apo - there is really not much more to report. One average to good blotter smoked in about 5 pieces so that each bit was a single puff. Effects only took 5 minutes to come on and were as described above. In those days I used to get 8-12 horus out of a blotter, but in the smoked form it would only be about 5 hours. Of that it would be no more than an hour of solid tripping, but this was spaced out over the 5 hours by lots of breaks (as described).

It's weird and wastefull, so I didn't do it often.

[hoodoo]

Like friendly said, the heating of the LSA's as they are found in the seeds are unlikely to have anything to do with any visual effect, unless they convert to something different when heated. More likely it is another component of the plant that cuased said people's inebriation. The LSA rich fungus growing on cypress are also unlikely to be effective visually when heated, again, unless they somehow are altered to a new, as yet unknown chemcial that is active. LSD anyway, if comparable to LSA, when heated doesn't do squat.

Also, Friendly noted:

According to christian theology, if your wife dies before you do, you will meet her in heaven and be together for eternity after you die.

This purportedly answers the age old question "Is there an afterwife?"

My guess would be that the theolegians that taught the law above, made it up to frighten husbands from considering murder as a way to get out of a bad partnership.

[Torsten]

Like friendly said, the heating of the LSA's as they are found in the seeds are unlikely to have anything to do with any visual effect, unless they convert to something different when heated.

Why? The seeds themselves are very visual, so there is obviously a visual LSA present in the seed (without requiring conversion).

More likely it is another component of the plant that cuased said people's inebriation.

It may well be, but that is being rather insulting to the people who have a vast amount of experience with LSA's and should be able to tell the difference between an LSA inebriation or otherwise

LSD anyway, if comparable to LSA, when heated doesn't do squat.

As I stated above, this is simply not true. Maybe you were doing it wrong, but I personally and several of my friends have had good experiences with this. As there was no other active constituent on blotters (this is 15 years ago) the effects we got were obviously from smoking the LSD and not some other natural pyrolysis byproduct of crude plant material. Hence, if LSD is smokable then there is no reason why LSAs should not produce LSA type effects when smoked regardless of what else is in the plant material.

Denying activity in the face of evidence to the contrary never makes a lot of sense. 15 years ago the majority of salvia smokers also claimed salvia to be inactive. It was due to the persistence of those who got effects that salvia became more widely known and is widely appreciated. Those who claimed salvia to be inactive kinda look rather silly these days.

[Amulte]

would spider grass be Ophiopogon planiscapus?

[apothecary]

lol check the first post Amulte ;)

[t st tantra]

scirpis[scirpus] aka isolepsis is another cyperaceae that has some record of psychoactive use.

i have memory of references in pharmacotheon and esp pharmco-poeia.

oz native isolepsis nodosa,knobby club-rush appeared to have similar effects to the cyperus sp already tested in a recent bioassay.

from entheology.org

Scirpus atrovirens - Bakana

- Cyperaceae - Cosmopolitan

One of the most powerful herbs of the Tarahumara of Mexico is apparently a species of Scirpus. Some medicine men carry Bakana to relieve pain. The tuberous underground part is believed to cure insanity, and the whole plant is a protector of those suffering from mental ills.

ACTIVE PRINCIPLES:

Alkaloids have been reported from Scirpus as well as from the related genus Cyperus.

EFFECTS:

The intoxication which it induces enables Indians to travel far and wide, talk with dead ancestors, and see brilliantly colored visions. Some medicine men carry Bakana to relieve pain. The tuberous underground part is believed to cure insanity, and the whole plant is a protector of those suffering from mental ills.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

TRADITIONAL PREPARATION: The tuberous root of this plant is used, exact preparation is not known.

just a note that as narayan has said the flowers of spider grass are also active.seriously its worth learning to id spider grass plants cos they are very common and you should be able to locate a source near you!

i beleive most cyperaceae will prove to have some activity!

t s t .

'dmt is everywhere' terrence mc kenna

'lsa's and maoi are everywhere' t st tantra

[hoodoo]

This is the first time I heard of anyone smoking blotter for any effect. Thanks for the report.

I kept to smoking only dirty carpets, newspapers, magazines and Freak Brothers Comics, they never seemed to work though.

[Torsten]

what? no banana peel??

[mescalito]

Forgot the peanut shells

[hoodoo]

Maya ethnobotanicals tossed in some free bakana roots with lsa on them, or at least that bunch of roots were known to be active, as others had tried them and stated they were like LSA, so it is beleived a fungus had grown on them. I suppose the fungus might stillbe viable if it has the right plant matter to grow on. I am not any longer into ingesting LSA or anything of that sort as over did that 30 years ago, and also found half of the adventure on woodrose or morninglory to be too puky and the accompanying somatic distress was only for the young and bold. I still have the 5 Cypress roots although they must be 4 or so years old, and I never did anything at all with them. I am sad to say, that at that time the roots were viable, and I do not know if they still are. I also do not know if Maya's still has them in stock, but he is the only source I have ever come across for those little roots. I wonder where I put them???????? I guess it is time to go make a mess.

[M S Smith]

Just thought I would throw this in. The first thread discussed Cyperus species. These are Cyperaceae, graminoids (grass or grass-like plants). The following is from my Sacramental and Medicinal Cacti and should be of interest. I would be interested in any information anyone might have to offer about the Cyperaceae of Chihuahua, Mexico, as I bet that "Scirpus" was just thrown onto the plant which might now be classified differently.

~Michael~

Note #5

"[An] unidentified Scirpus sp. from various locations throughout the Tarahumara region is known as a very powerful herb and is considered one of their most important hallucinogenic plants and is said to be stronger than peyote. Zingg states that “if you put the two in the same bag, they [the Tarahumara] say they will fight and the grass will always win.”

The underground tubers, or “bolitas,” are often cultivated and sold to the Tarahumara who fear growing the plants themselves, believing they will cause insanity. The plants must not be offended as to do so will lead to the sickness and death of the offender; therefore, the Tarahumara sing to them and occasionally offer them food before actual use. Though so feared, they are used to cure the insane and treat mental illness while being an effective medicine to relieve pain and cure physical illness.

The plant, being applied to the body or ingested, must be used cautiously out of concern that it will cause one to leap into fires. It is said that ingestion of the tubers causes a deep sleep where one can “travel” over great distances, speak with deceased relatives, and experience brilliant colors.

Harmaline (B-carboline) alkaloids have been located within Scirpus, making it a possible source of monoamine oxidase inhibition. Such a property, if used internally with alkaloid containing cacti, may have the effect of increasing or altering the psychoactivity of either species when used independently. It is unknown if there had ever been cultural use of such a plant combination, but it seems quite likely considering the sacred status of both Scirpus and many cactus species.

A number of Scirpus species are considered medicines by North American Indians and have been used to stop bleeding, to treat sort throats, abscesses, sores, and snakes bites. They have also been used as a sedative for crying children. They have also been used as ritual emetics and have been used in the Sun Dance Ceremony of the Cheyenne Indians."

[M S Smith]

t st tantra mentioned Scirpus atrovirens previously (I overlooked it), but it would appear that that plant couldn't be the Tarahumara "Bakana" as this species isn't known from northwestern Mexico, but rather from the eastern US.

http://www.npwrc.usgs.gov/resource/othrdat...es/sciratro.htm

~Michael~

[-YT-]

Another report on the activity of spider grass this time in conjunction with DMT. I had the opportunity to catch up with a friend who told me about his journey using the spider grass. He said he had the journey on a large hill overlooking the city/suburbs an amazing sight in itself, he found a comfortable spot on the side of this large hill and sat down. He smoked a cone of dried spider grass followed by Dmt a standard size cone he usually uses for himself and as soon as it hit, incredibly more intense with an overwhelming feeling of body heat and the overpowering urge to vommit, this did have a slight affect on the journey but he said it was still enjoyable and a very good learning experience, he also said that the effects lasted a bit longer then usuall. he said the spider grass increased the effects 2-3 times. he said this journey was very different then just dmt by itself. If anyone else has any other reports of spider grass used with tryptamines please do share.

[narayan]

^

I can also vouch for this, spidergrass seemed to kick the dmt experience up a notch and the resulting afterglow was stronger and lasted for longer. Although a 3 disprin headache was noted several hours after the experience.

[t st tantra]

i've been looking for some spidergrass pics,this is the best i've found so far.....

http://images.search.yahoo.com/search/imag...-web-t&ei=UTF-8

and why is there so little interest in the plants i've offered?

much the same reason there has been so little acceptance of this topic?

these plants are common ,i'd ideally like you all to find it growing near you!

t s t .