Lucid Dreaming

[Slybacon]

Last night I was able to become aware I was dreaming. It has happened to me on a number of occasions. I first started being able to notice I was dreaming when I quit smoking green, but now I smoke everyday and I can still do it.

One of the best lucid moments I had occurred when I was on holidays in Bali. I was engaged in a dream that involved the hotel we were staying at. In the dream I was cooling off in the pool when I noticed a tree that I couldn't remember being there, at that moment I had a flash vision of myself laying in the hotel bed, in the vision I was looking down at myself from above the bed. The vision I had in my dream was similar to imagining something so hard you sort of lose sight of whats in front of you. After the quick vision I was back in the dream looking at this tree. My brain was working overload trying to make sense of what was going on when I came up with the idea of being in a dream. To test myself I decided that if this truly was a dream then I could most probably breath underwater. I dived to the bottom of the pool and laid on my back looking up at the surface. light poured in through the mirrored surface like sun through clouds on a rainy day. It was very vivid and very relaxing. I took a deep breath in and out. No bubbles! I was dreaming. At this point my mind split and I was able to picture myself laying in the hotel bed in the same position I was laying in the bottom of the pool. My minds eye of myself was second to the reality of laying on the bottom of the pool. I struggled to stay asleep at this point and decided to meditate on the warmth of the sun. I laid there in complete bliss for what felt like 10mins before waking. This is the place I imagine myself when I want to relax, the bottom of a Balinese hotel pool has become my happy place.

I hadn't lucid dreamed since Bali last year, until now. Last night I was in some sort of complex dream involving a school I had never attended. I started climbing up a large education style staircase with 12 ft ceilings. After four levels something felt odd, at that moment for no real reason I just became aware that I was in a dream. This time I tried to notice the small details. The dirt on the floor, the texture and color of the paint, the smell of dust in the air. This staircase was about as real as it gets, except it wasn't going anywhere. As I climbed higher I gradually woke up.... I should of went down! maybe the staircase was leading back to my woken state. Maybe we all symbolically wake up and don't realise. I contribute this phenomenon to the fact I don't use an alarm. In the last 10 years I have never been late for work. I always wake up naturally. If you were to tell me to wake up at a certain time, i can usually do this to within 10 mins, but i prefer to let the sun wake me up.

Does anyone else have any lucid dream stories to share?

How do you know you are dreaming?

How much control do you have?

Do you think some things in dreams can have symbolic meanings?

[Scientician]

I was actually lucid dreaming myself last night. The trick is to keep moving. I find that once you try to stop & look around you wake up. Anyway... I entered the dream & was already on horseback hammering across the desert & severe thunderstorm was closing in behind me. To my left is another man riding in-sync with me but I'm unaware of who this person is. Then right at the point where I felt like had good control of the dream I came to an instant halt & I couldn't push the dream forward. Then an enormous demon confronted me (it appeared to be made purely out of marble). It then very harshly said to me "I don't like you or what you are trying to do here, get out". I then woke up immediately. The lucidity didn't return after I fell asleep again.

[C_T]

only when i'm severely sleep deprived, thats when i have crazy rem behaviour. Sleep paralysis, hypnogogic hallucinations, the works...

Not fun and certainly something i don't enjoy.

[Magicdirt]

Lucid dreams are common when you go to a different place to where you'd normally sleep, I think it's tied in with the energy flow in the area where you sleep, even re arranging your furniture can be enough to stimulate lucid dreams.

I can do it sometimes but it can be like C.T. said and be an indicator that some area of your life is out of balance.

Traditional Chinese Medicine has a different take on dreams than westerners, sometimes it can give insights into the meaning of dreams.

TCM dreams

[mr b.caapi]

i good thing to do, and ive tried and tested it, is to ask yourself throughout the day and evening "Am i dreaming" and to look around for anything out of place and unusual. For this to work you need to make it a habit, a real habit, make it become part of your every day waking life. Soon it becomes such a habit, almost an involontary action that it actually occurs in your thoughts in your dreams. As soon as you notice anything unusual or out of place in your dream, you become aware that your dreaming and lucidity occurs. The hardest part is learning to actually stay dreaming and not wake up. Another thing is actually remembering youve done it. There have been times where i have had a full blown lucid dream and forgotten it in the morning, its not until something reminds me of the dream and i think " Shit, thats right i had a lucid dream last night" its strange stuff and i really enjoy it.

[Distracted]

Reading this thread and about how hard it is to stay asleep once you're aware... kinda reminds me of how hard it can be to stay 'tuned in' and turn off external distractions in certain situations.

[faustus]

yeah it's been years and years since i was massively into lucid dreaming.

slybacon, if you haven't seen it yet, i thoroughly recommend the animation "waking life" ... it's my favourite, i've watched it more than 10 times, and it's still fuckin dope

Does anyone else have any lucid dream stories to share?

hah. they say there's nothing more boring than hearing about someone' else's dreams, so i shall spare you!

How do you know you are dreaming?

mr b caapi is spot on -- about method, about needing to remember. i'll reiterate what he said about making it a habit: seriously, it's hella important to make a habit of it. once a conscious action becomes unconscious i.e. habitual via repetition, then you'll start asking if you're dreaming when you're actually dreaming, and then you'll become lucid.

How much control do you have?

it's difficult, at least for me -- 90% of the time the visions were very unstable, constantly morphing based on my shifting thoughts. i imagine someone good at meditation would be pretty chronic at it tho. that said, there were a handful of times where i had very stable visions that were "hi resolution" -- essentially as realistic as the sensory experience we have in day to day life. from the journal articles i've read, these visions are said to be remarkably reminiscent of 150-200 mg IM ketamine.

Do you think some things in dreams can have symbolic meanings?

yes -- but i don't think it needs to be symbolic anymore if it's a lucid dream.

essentially lucid dreaming is an experience characterised by the freedom to construct any mindscape you desire. as a consequence, the reality you choose to construct would be derived from your deepest hungers and desires and fears and anxieties, that only you are intimately aware of. in the absence of any observer, you can indulge in anything, without the judgement of others -- of the infinite array of possibilities, the reality you subsequently make will inherently say something about you.

[mutant]

I am not good at this myself, but I know some people and have read and discussed a bit about this.

amanita breakthrough felt a lot like what lucid dreaming feels. I once had a short of lucid dream and I assume it was lucid because I was like starring in a film with lots of chases, horror and nasty situations, and I remember enjoying myself immensly.

There are several techniques and tricks to be better at this - the habit thing others said, but I think some people are more talented and predisposed than others, in a way like they're particularly good at it or lucidity just occurs to them in their dreams often, spontaneously. I also felt during my amanita trips that a season lucid dreamer would be much better than a first timer in navigating through such a world. Green habit is not good for dreams research, they say. No wonder since green seems to suppress dreaming or at least recollection.

Do you think some things in dreams can have symbolic meanings?

yeah, but mostly symbolisms around self, and projections from and to self.

I would like to hear faustus take on how dreams and lucid dreams could be compared to dissociative experiences

[C_T]

We are not supposed to remember the fiction, fairy-tail dreams...

During REM (rapid eye movement sleep), real memories are replayed from short term memory to a different part of the brain, creating a copy. We call this copy long-term memory. So we spend about 20% of the night in REM, throughout the night (3, 4 or 5 separate times), and the dreams you don't remember doing are this process. Without this, we wouldn't have long-term memory and hence intelligent decisions like where's the water holes, where's the food in this season etc is remembered and passed down.

All mammals dream.

Now as we awaken from REM, we can sometimes guide the dream. This is the fairy tail stuff and hence should not be remembered for much longer than a few seconds after awakening, why? Because otherwise your brain can get confused as to whether you actually did an event or simply dreamt it.

We use the same part of the brain in REM as we do now, but extra's as well. We paralyse our body so we don't act out the dreams (hence often dream we are in slow motion). Awake/Sleep and REM/non-REM are controlled by different parts of the brain, when sleep deprived or stressed or etc, things can start to go wrong, happen out of order... We can become consious while still asleep, even in REM. Or the opposite we can be unconsious and sleep talk/walk and hallucinating.

But although memory storage is a major factor of REM sleep, problem solving also exists... the subconsious can work stuff out for us, many mathematicians, physicists etc have claimed their proofs came to them in a dream and they quickly wrote it down. Artists might see their drawing, or music notes, or poems etc. Different people get different insights. These happen in the transition from REM to awake, it happens in a split second even though it feels like aages, thats just because the brain is running at full speed and we have no perception of time while asleep.

[Teljkon]

sdsdssdf

Edited December 19, 2021 by Teljkon

[ThunderIdeal]

ah yes floating

wait

what's floating?

[mr b.caapi]

I assume he means Astral travel.

[Teljkon]

adasad

Edited December 19, 2021 by Teljkon

[C_T]

As we initiate sleep onset our muscles relax, when we hit REM we paralyse ourselves completely, only the diaphram is moving, allowing us to breath.

I would suspect your feeling this initiation of muscles relaxing, sometimes it can cause sleep starts, where you feel like your falling and jerk awake. Other times you can relish in it, and i believe this is where you may feel separation from your body.

ok no more sleep talk from me

[Teljkon]

asdasd

Edited December 19, 2021 by Teljkon

[hutch]

I'm no expert on this subject...don't seem to be on manybut I have a strong internal sense that those who can control their dreams and remember are older and much more advanced souls than the average. It may sound a bit looney but I believe that when a person is in those deep stages of sleep and when only your respiratory system seems to be functioning as C_T said earlier that our souls can return home or travel anywhere they wish...they will act out situations that the soul believes will assist when it is taking a back seat to the human experience...sounds silly to most but common sense to me. Most of us never remember any of it...older souls do and souls reaching that stage like Bacon described are getting closer to that level. Not there yet..maybe a few more incarnations on the earth or elsewhere is all they need....Do I blame the green that I don't remember?.... more the bloody red. Who can go past those 5 litre cask's for value.

C_T

 

We use the same part of the brain in REM as we do now, but extra's as well. We paralyse our body so we don't act out the dreams (hence often dream we are in slow motion).

You seem to have a descent grasp of the sleep cycle there C_T...cool...I have had this happen to me a lot for my whole life. Don't no if it is slow motion or I just can't move fast enough...some thing or one is always chasing me at the time...scares the crap out of me and I sit up in a panic...

C_T

Artists might see their drawing, or music notes, or poems etc. Different people get different insights.

I wrote a song straight after a dream one morning about 6 years ago that just spewed out of me like I had heard it before..Cant't right music but I do write a lot of lyrics. The name, tune and lyrics were just in my head on waking..."Tooting horns and telephones" is what it was called.....I either learnt that during my dream or some soul was pouring it out for me.

Still no idea why...

[opiumfreak]

anybody have experiences of astral travel?

btw Im pretty stoned now

Edited June 17, 2011 by opiumfreak

[Ulca]

Its strange... The only dreams i remember are my lucid dreams. I need help i miss dreaming..

Last dream i had was about a year n a half ago, very lucid dream.. It was a fun experience once i realized what was going on..

When i lucid dream, it usually starts like a normal dream, seeing faces and what not, but for some reason, the second my memory function kicks in, its as if it kicks my entire brain into "On mode" and it doesnt realize that its in a dream until i stop and think "this isnt right, im supposed to be laying bed." then i realize im in my own realm and start to have some fun with it.

I find it odd that the second my memory turns on to remember a dream, my entire brain kicks over and becomes active, regardless of being in reality or not. its very annoying, i know i have a great imagination and would have very interesting non-lucid dreams, if only i could remember them without actually having to partake in them .

Perhaps my brain is inferior in the sense that it needs this part to run to make this part run... Perhaps its the opposite? My brain trained itself to fully shut off in order to fully rest? ...

I WANNA HAVE A NORMAL DREAM!!!!! !!!!

[hutch]

There are some drugs that have a negative influence on ones ability to dream, or at least recall the dream...

[ThunderIdeal]

tobacco smokers apparently don't recall their dreams and are almost horrified by the influx of dreaming when they quit.

i like dreams, they don't have to be lucid. i also like the hypnagogic state and unlike dreams i frequently do realise that i am in the hypnagogic state and i'm usually able to go with it rather than snapping out of it. of course, the hypnagogic state carries one to sleep very quickly.

if you'd care to elaborate CT, why does the paralysed physical body lead to the semi-paralysed dream body?

[platypii]

I can't not have lucid dreams. I'v had them; along with sleepwalking/talking/extreme hypnagogic hallucinogenia since I was a youngster, as well as almost permamenet insomnia. The sleep I do have is almost always that deep type, almost immediately plunged into incredibly bizarre dreamscapes- which iteself can almost immediately wake me up.

In my own experience, cannabis dulls this a fair bit; caffeine stimulates it; any psychedelic or entheogen colours it darkly, and removes luciditiy to a degree; opiates make lucidity total. I would say that the lucid "dream" state feels like returning to an ongoing train of thought that is supressed during "waking" moments.

An interesting phenomemon is deja vu within a dream, or the sense of "waking" life having the same ethereal quality that dreamland does, just inverted. A frigtening feeling is a dream within a dream- if this happens (for me) it tends to be multiple layers of dream-wthin-ness. The sense of deja vu almost feels dangerous.

See you in your dreams ahahahaha....sorry :D

[Undergrounder]

anybody have experiences of astral travel?

btw Im pretty stoned now

 

Yeah for sure I used to contribute to a forum about OBEs and astral projection and I racked up like 700 posts... I have books on it and everything.

Like platypii, some people just slip into this kind of state very easily... you can train yourself to do it, and I could do it with about a 30% success rate every night if I really tried. It helps to be tired to begin with, but not 'too' tired. About 1 - 2 hours after you normally go to bed is a good time to try it. Then you need to drift off to sleep and ...juuussttt when you're about to fall asleep, suddenly regain awareness.

I made an .mp3 of about an hour of my favourite sleepytime music tracks to help me do it. The first track was the same as the last track, with different songs in the middle. The idea was to meditate on your desire to astral project (really think about it, how you want to do it, how calm you will be when you do it, etc.) during the first track. Then, when the track is replayed at the end of the .mp3, it's replayed at about twice the volume. The idea is you develop a strong association between OBEs and that song. You start to drift off to sleep during the hour that other music is playing, and then when the track comes back at the end, it's slightly louder, it wakes you up and subconsciously the OBE associations remind you to try and project. It's usually enough to bring you back to lucidity without 'waking you up'.

I get them a fair bit, the problem is remembering them. As profound and awesome as they are at the time, you forget about them so easily... At the time you're telling yourself 'OMG that was awesome, i'll never forget that!! no need to wake up, etc. But you forget about them!!

I was looking at the Corrobborree boards this arvo and I saw a topic about God-spot and that's when I suddenly remembered the partial one I had last night! So I posted about it there:

I was lying down going to sleep (on my back), when my arms started floating up into the air and stayed there, motionless, like helium baloons anchored to the rest of my body.

I opened my eyes and saw my arms (floating there), then looked over to the right and saw a shadow on the wall that took the shape of a giant black eye... I was overcome with the feeling that I was in the presence of something great - godlike - not evil, but 'awesome' in the traditional sense of the word. Something to be feared but respected.

Then I caught myself and realised I was hallucinating... I stayed in the state for a while, the experience was quite euphoric. I had full self-awareness (like with a lucid dream) and enjoyed the state a lot. But after a while I got bored of it and opened my eyes (for real this time) and noticed my arms were still tucked safely away under the covers... no shadows on the wall, etc.

I can verify that it's a real-time experience and not a dream because I often go to sleep listening to music. During the experience I could clearly hear, in normal time, one of the songs I was listening to at the time. After I got up I could see the song listed previously on my media player. Also the experience is qualitatively different to a (lucid) dream - it feels real, I'm perfectly self-aware, can think rationally and easily. Details are finer. The only dream-like quality is that short-term memory seems absolutely buggered. It's not a lucid dream, because it doesn't start as a dream and feels perfectly real. A hallucination / delerium would be a closer description. Technically I call them OBEs (due to the floating, which sometimes extends to the whole body), or hypnagogic hallucinations.

[Undergrounder]

An interesting phenomemon is deja vu within a dream, or the sense of "waking" life having the same ethereal quality that dreamland does, just inverted.

 

Do you mean that you have Deja vu in your dreams? Like you're in a dream and you feel like you've been in that dream before? (during the dream?) I love it when this happens... it's like you're returning to a special magical place that exists on the other side of sleep.. Real Narnia type stuff. The deja vu is usually enough to jolt you into lucidity too.

[Slybacon]

I had a lucid dream on the weekend. When I realised I was dreaming I tried to find someone to talk to. As soon as I entered the next room 2 people just turned straight at me with a weird stare. I wanted to talk to them and ask them questions I needed answers too, but as soon as I opened my mouth I woke up.

Does anyone have any techniques they use to stay asleep.,

[platypii]

Do you mean that you have Deja vu in your dreams? Like you're in a dream and you feel like you've been in that dream before? (during the dream?) I love it when this happens... it's like you're returning to a special magical place that exists on the other side of sleep.. Real Narnia type stuff. The deja vu is usually enough to jolt you into lucidity too.

 

You know the sensation one can get in waking life of unreality; you might simply be walking down the street and suddenly ask yourself 'is this a dream?'- the opposite ocurring (ie. asking yourself 'am I awake?' while dreaming) is quite an odd sensation. Leads to a whole lot of odd metaphysical complications...