help explaining the levels of the psychedelic world

[ubza_1234]

hey guys. I'm trying to explain the differen't levels that different psychedelic can take you. Like weed will open your mind to understand new concepts by, to an extent knocking down part of the dim barrier. I hear mdma would take you to the next level although i'v never had this befor so can't comment from experience. Next would be mushrooms. They are can show you so much if you look for it. But are very playful so it's a bit harder to learn from. Cactus is more serious as it is a much better teacher. It seems it's there to teach and although it is great fun can easily be serious if need be. Dmt is the top level. It takes you beyond this world to a place were you are able to meet spirits beyond this world in a way that is difficult, but not impossible on the previous drugs. These are all my opinion btw and they are all different drugs that do different things so i can't say one is stronger them another, they simply do different things and there are plenty of other drugs to fit in there that i'v missed too.

Anyway, back to the topic at hand, is there a good reference i can show to the miss's so she can understand it? She said she wants to know about it but i'm crap at explaining these things to ppl, but ppl who know what i'm talking about will know strate away ;)

any web sites or books or what ever?

Thanks guys ;)

[mud]

I'd be more likely to just explain it through some appropriate metaphor.

like,

the universe is a big crosshatching matrix of light.

It sometimes has doors,

and we can sometimes travel along highways.

Each different psychedelic,

has the holographic potential of the whole.

I've found any substance can achieve anything. Having more to do with belief,

and hence the suggestions or expectation one haves of it.

Its up to each person, how they use the key or the car..

and its nice,

if each and every one can go with what feels best for them. with what calls personally to them.

Intuitively speaking.

I think we're probably all making it up as we go

[Foton]

Terence McKenna talked of DMT being the center of the mandala... with other drugs placing your further away from centre.

[JDanger]

There are so many books and writings devoted to this topic it's not even funny. Every drug will do something different; the differences grow exponentially when you realise every person will react to them differently under particular circumstances.

"The Varieties of Psychedelic Experience" by Masters & Houston is a good starting point, but one can never learn it all. You can get it as an e-book here http://www.scribd.com/doc/20565661/The-Varieties-of-Psychedelic-Experience

[ThunderIdeal]

I'd be more likely to just explain it through some appropriate metaphor.

like,

the universe is a big crosshatching matrix of light.

It sometimes has doors,

and we can sometimes travel along highways.

Each different psychedelic,

has the holographic potential of the whole.

I've found any substance can achieve anything. Having more to do with belief,

and hence the suggestions or expectation one haves of it.

Its up to each person, how they use the key or the car..

and its nice,

if each and every one can go with what feels best for them. with what calls personally to them.

Intuitively speaking.

I think we're probably all making it up as we go

 

that's awesome mud

i dunno but i think, as you alluded to in your first post, ordering these molecules in a hierarchy is probably pointless/erroneous. also the same molecule can take you to many different levels.

you might be after a run down of the basic fx of well known molecules and their categorisation, eg tryptamines (shrooms, dmt) and ergotamines (lsa, lsd), entactogens like mdma (mescaline seems a bit like a cross between lsd and mdma) or in terms of chemical structure these are PEA's, there are MAOI's like harmala which allow prevent your body from breaking down amines and effect your normal chemistry as well as lengthening the endurance of certain ingested molecules..... disocciatives.... cannibinoids.. hopefully i haven't said anything misleading, but i too would be interested in some concise info on how these molecules alter our chemistry and how that alters our perceptions, behaviour and consciousness. probably best if you just do some research though, erowid is probably a great start.

IMHO tryptamines, mescaline and acid are the most powerful of the well known drugs, they literally blow your mind and can cause a spiritual ecstacy which goes so far beyond the euphoria of speed and mdma (speed and mdma tend to involve basic waking reality where tripping opens up many other layers of reality). however dmt is a bit like a rollercoaster ride IMHO, it's a crazy trip that doesn't tend to give a lot of useful insight, although don't take my word for it.

[t st tantra]

have a look at the work of leary,robert anton wilson and john c lilly on the periodic table of evolution,also known by other names.imho this should be better known and i have found it useful to orientate me many times.

t s t .

octave of energy might be another name for it....

Edited May 29, 2010 by t st tantra

[ubza_1234]

thunderideal:although i'm personally interested in the chemical interactions with the human chemistry, that wasn't the point of this post. Could you post it somewere tho cause it sounds very interesting. and comparing drugs is comparing bus's and cars. I enjoy using both for different reasons. I like cars cause i'm in control, i choose exactly were i wanna go, how fast i go, i can behave how i want inside my car, (dance, sing loudly, etc) i have the option of driving alone, and i can park right out the front of my mates place. Bus's can (arguably) be less predictable, less comfortable, there are always ppl there to talk to if you wish, there easy to use, as long as you buy a ticket, YOU can't really fuck up and die/it's not your fault, i can play guitar on my trip, if i don't pay attention to whats going on, no big deal but it rarely can take you exactly were you want but gets you close. perhaps in a technical sense, different drugs expose different layers of the sub conscious? I dunno

anyway, i'm more interested in the different ways these drugs can teach us different things and were those things can take us. In a personal/spiritual sorta way.

Good stuff so far tin thanks

Edited May 28, 2010 by ubza_1234

[t st tantra]

you might find 'psychedelic information theory' interesting....there was a discussion thread on it here but this is a link to the book preview...

http://www.tripzine.com/

t s t .

http://www.google.com.au/search?q=octave+wilson+leary&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a

Edited May 29, 2010 by t st tantra

[Chiral]

The brain can be dark place generally...a boring filing room that just plugs away doing it's daily tasks, think of a single 25 watt incandescent light swinging from a cord in a room where the light from the bulb is so dim and poor that you can't even see where the walls in the room are..in fact you have never seen the walls in the filing room, you just assume they are there.

One day while processing your usual run of the mill tasks, an envelope is opened from the in-box...there is something different about this envelope,.. as it is opened, an emanating bright light seeps out like a genie out of a bottle, it begins to slowly illuminates the room...you struggle to understand why bright light is pouring out of the envelope and become unbalanced as you try to keep hold of it...you look around once you have the envelope under control. For the first time you notice that there are no walls in this room...you stand up from your seat and take the envelope with it's swirling moving light and try to see whats out there..you aim in one direction like a torch, you see something...what was that..!! you stumble a bit and lose control of the envelope as you become a little unbalanced.

Your eyes are struggling to see and comprehend what is out there yet you feel compelled to look and find fascination with the shadows and colors that appear to be constantly evolving and shifting...you can't quite be sure what you are seeing as the suddenly boundless room has no depth anymore and appears to go on infinitely...you stand for hours, slowing moving the envelope around bit by bit trying to work out whats out there...you have seen some of the stuff before but can't understand what it is doing out there. The room suddenly feels like it has more meaning than usual, you understand everything but what is everything, you knew about this but how, I need more light so I see further and understand more. This is beautiful, I love this, I love everything, I am now at peace..I take baby steps out of usual comfort zone, I want to discover more and learn...

After some time the light from the envelope starts to get weaker and dimmer....you look at it and shake it to get it work again...it's no use, it's starting to go out...

finally it's out and you drop it on the floor as you try to stumble back to your usual seat...you feel a little unwell and groggy...so much has happened, but what has happened...did that even happen at all...you find your seat and sit back down under your swinging light bulb in your dimly lit room, back to those mundane tasks, some afterthoughts linger, you want to tell someone...they won't understand surely...meh I'll keep it to myself, no one would believe me anyways...I hope I get another one of those envelopes again so I can go out and search those frontiers again...perhaps I could go further out there next time to explore even more...that's was very cool...I will be prepared next time and dress accordingly, I want to trek further and further...shhh..I best get back to my routine though.

[Legba]

in essence, we are sapling's. the beginnings of a tree.

as we grew, and dropped leaves on the ground which composted, a variety of weeds began to grow from the compost, representing our personalities.

due to gods seemingly random ways, the weeds have grown at a much faster rate than the sapling. indeed, the weeds are now blocking all the sun.

entheogens can move the weeds out of the way to let some sun get to the sapling, who had forgotten that a sun even exists.

too much sun can kill the sapling.

entheogens can also mulch some of the weeds resulting in more compost and more weeds.

if the sapling clears the weeds, the branches could be thought of as different dimensions, and each offshoot another, then imagine it way deeper than that. lol

Edited May 30, 2010 by Legba

[ubza_1234]

sweet stuff guys thanks

[ThunderIdeal]

this is just coming from my own perspective: acid, mushrooms and mescaline allow you to begin understanding god.

i doubt they frequently have this effect if some random materialistic person ingests them, but in conjunction with a personal (sober) quest for understanding of self and reality, involving the practice of meditation, and then ingested in the right setting, insights into the nature of god flow quite freely. by correct setting, i tend to think most sorts of discussions with most people are very distracting and will get you nowhere. the outdoors makes a great backdrop, i also think psytrance is a great backdrop. these kinds of sensory inputs seem to provide nearly unlimited fuel for the entheogen to display it's lessons.

with any of these three substances, the duration is such that you go through several stages of different insights. they work pretty well at a dose where unbelievably complex patterns/geometry flows around you constantly, but even better when they get weirder than that (powerful synesthesia, trancing out, almost leaving your body). with regards to the geometry, one should easily comprehend, with a bit of experience maybe, that they are experiencing hyper dimensions, which are reminiscent of crystal structures. comprehending this, one will realise that they have been like a bug that skims across the water without any way of gauging how deep the ocean is. being in touch with their chakra system, their mind incredibly relaxed and witnessing an endless stream of perfection, one may start to see the cat and mouse game they are participating in. one way i can attempt to word it is that suppression of self is a ball of string that simultaneously unravels and winds itself back up. suppression of self seems to me such a precarious, miraculous state. how can knowledge of self be forgotten? at every moment, from every angle, self threatens to be found.

hmmm, what i'm trying to get at is that you tune in to a higher reality, even though you don't ever quite understand how to interpret it down into lower reality understanding. hmmmm. i sometimes say that the acid experience must be like god's point of view, but perhaps it's better to say that it's as though you are temporarily a yoga guru. you become aware of your higher faculties, psychic abilities, your connection to and place within a super consciousness.

[The Dude]

^^^ well put.

[ThunderIdeal]

thanks dude, that means so much to me coming from you.

[botanika]

Alcohol: is like wearing football boots

Weed: is like wearing Ugg boots

LSD: is like wearing crosstrainers

Mushrooms: is like wearing basketball shoes

Mescaline: is like wearing hiking boots

DMT: is like wearing running spikes

Datura: is like wearing ski-gloves on your feet

Ibogine: is like wearing clogs

Speed: is like not wearing shoes

Heroin: Is like wearing wellie's

Cocaine: is like wearing high heels or cowboy boots

Meth: is like wearing an old worn out pair of dunlop volleys with new laces

MDMA: is like wearing pink fluffy slippers

[ThunderIdeal]

not really.

[Chiral]

Meth: is like wearing an old worn out pair of dunlop volleys with new laces

MDMA: is like wearing pink fluffy slippers

 

LMAO...these are my two favorites and I totally agree...

[mutant]

Datura: is like wearing ski-gloves on your feet

lol

is speed and meth different?

[botanika]

lol

is speed and meth different?

 

Have you ever worn dunlop volleys? Kinda like bare feet ;) Edited June 3, 2010 by botanika

[ThunderIdeal]

lol

is speed and meth different?

 

not really. meth is the molecule, a more euphoric variation of the amphetamine molecule. the term ice refers to high purity meth.

according to torsten the weaker molecule 'amphetamine' isn't really manufactured in australia, but this may not be the case in other countries.