US police can inject suspects with date rape drug

[Auxin]

Are Forced Injections the New Taser?

By: Gerri L. Elder

While most people are aware of police use of Taser weapons, many may be fairly shocked to learn of an alternate method used by police in Nashville, Tennessee to subdue "unruly" people. The city has a policy allowing police to inject unruly people that they encounter on the street with a strong sedative.

One of the doctors responsible for this bright idea claims that it is the safest option available and that it is being used all over the country. However, a top medical ethicist says that it is troubling.

The drug used by police is Midazolam, which is better known as Versed. This drug is commonly used with patients undergoing a colonoscopy. It has an amnesia side effect, according to biomedical ethics and law enforcement expert Dr. Steven Miles.

While the use of the drug is safe for patients who have been screened and had their medical histories reviewed, its use on the street is a bit alarming.

One of the first people to receive a shot of Versed courtesy of the Nashville Police, Dameon Beasley, admits that he was off his medication and out of control at the time. He was shot with a police Taser gun and then officers called for emergency medical personnel to give him the injection. Police held him down while he was given the shot. He described the effect of the injection as immediate and like a "horse tranquilizer," according to a WSMV News report.

When he woke up, Beasley had no idea what had happened to him or how much time had passed. He says that as he came to he saw a sergeant standing over him telling him to sign a paper. He says that he signed the paper without knowing what he was signing. As a result, Beasley ended up in psychiatric care at the hospital. His lawyer says that he had no idea that he had been injected with Versed until he was told that it happened.

Beasley probably was not aware of the 2-year-old policy allowing the police to have people injected with the drug to immobilize them and give them amnesia. Few people are aware of the policy until they are injected, and given the amnesia effect of the drug, many are not even aware then. The Nashville Rescue Mission, Nashville's mental health judge and the American Civil Liberties Union all said that they are not aware of the use of drug injections by police in Nashville.

Dr. Corey Slovis, Nashville's emergency medical director, says that the Versed policy is no secret and that he has no idea why so many people do not know about it. Slovis and medical examiner Dr. Bruce Levy customized the forced injection drug policy for Nashville that has been endorsed by a group of medical experts called the Eagles.

Slovis says that the use of forced Versed injections is very common and when he surveyed major metropolitan areas around the country, he found only two cities that were not actively using the drug.

The standard for the use of a forced injection seems to be extremely similar to the excuses given for Taser use. The police call emergency medical technicians when a person is agitated and the paramedic is to determine if the person is in a state of "excited delirium." Excited delirium is not a recognized medical condition, nor is it a medical emergency requiring sedation.

Link

Is this happening in Oz yet?

[Teotzlcoatl]

Dr. Bruce Levy customized the forced injection drug policy for Nashville that has been endorsed by a group of medical experts called the Eagles.

The EAGLES?

Who the FUCK are the Eagles?

Makes ya want to beat the shit out of cops on site doesn't it? Maybe tazer them and inject them with (one of my personal favorites) a brugmanisa liquid extraction?

...maybe... just a little?

The police call emergency medical technicians when a person is agitated and the paramedic is to determine if the person is in a state of "excited delirium."

Maybe it's not "excited delirium" and maybe they're just... umm... mad? Probably cause some stupid fuckin' pig is hassling them!

Go arrest robbers, rapist and murders, leave the rest of us the fuck alone!!!

Thank for posting Auxin, sometimes I like to make myself sick by reading about how horrible the government I'm forced to live under SUCKS!!!

Edited September 10, 2008 by Teotz'

[ThunderIdeal]

why a drug that erases memory? terrible.

[MindExpansion]

That is super fucked up.

How that guy ended up signing the contract without realising, surely it wouldn't be legally binding though.

I think it is really disgusting that the cops can administer people with a heavy duty sedative without consent. And what about the health problems, anyone with a contraindicating pre-existing condition, or who is on a contraindicating medication at the time may suffer serious adverse health consequences, what a ridiculously un-ethical, and un-sensible law.

If it ever becomes law in this country (if it isn't already) we should fucking riot 'Burn down the parliament, burn down the flag'!

Thanks for posting Auxin.

Peace,

Mind

[ballzac]

why a drug that erases memory?

Yeah, that's just a little creepy.

[Ace]

I thought the American's had the right to own guns to protect themselves when their government turns on them? Is now not a good time? If this happened to me here in Aus, I'd sue them for everything I possibly could (and I hate when people sue others...).

[gromit]

this sort of shit makes literally makes me sick

i think it's more than 'a little creepy' ballzac, I like how ME explained it - 'super fucked up'

what i really hate is that they took him down with tazers first, THEN injected him... either one could've potentially killed him, as far as the cops knew. Surely only the first would have resulted in him being put in cuffs and the back off the divi van, so the questions is why did they then inject him?

imagine being in this guys shoes, waking up in a cop shop with no memory of what happened, being told you did all sorts of illegal shit, assaulted a cop or whatever. basically they could say you did anything, and you would have no way of arguing as you have no memory of the event. who is the court going to believe - a police officer or the "crazy person" he "had to" forcibly sedate?

i see this as just another way the police can be sure they can get their man put away, guilty or not.

[MindExpansion]

what i really hate is that they took him down with tazers first, THEN injected him... either one could've potentially killed him, as far as the cops knew. Surely only the first would have resulted in him being put in cuffs and the back off the divi van, so the questions is why did they then inject him?

imagine being in this guys shoes, waking up in a cop shop with no memory of what happened, being told you did all sorts of illegal shit, assaulted a cop or whatever. basically they could say you did anything, and you would have no way of arguing as you have no memory of the event. who is the court going to believe - a police officer or the "crazy person" he "had to" forcibly sedate?

Good point on the senslessness of the tazer/drug double team, why do they need to drug someone who they can cuff and restrain after tazing anyway? I do think the whole drugging thing has enourmous potential for abuse by police who want to see a guy put away. I wonder how many deaths have come of it? and how often it is actually used.

Peace

[ballzac]

Good point on the senslessness of the tazer/drug double team, why do they need to drug someone who they can cuff and restrain after tazing anyway? I do think the whole drugging thing has enourmous potential for abuse by police who want to see a guy put away. I wonder how many deaths have come of it? and how often it is actually used.

Peace

What about in cases where the detainee is not only a danger to others, but also a danger to themselves? Handcuffing someone won't stop them hurting themselves.

[MindExpansion]

Well it does help some. Also, how can the police, on site, adequately asses wether someone is a danger to themselves? And in that case ok maybe, but then to stick a contract in someones face as the cops above did? See the potential for misuse? I do get where your coming from though and in those cases it probably has a place, but not without its risks, such as the presence of unknown contraindications like I said before. It just seems quite unethical to me, but you make a good point and in those cases its probably fairly useful.

Peace

[faustus]

midazolam = benzo

the only thing i object to is the forcible administration of any drug. but the drug itself, man i'd probably act berserk if they were dishing it out for free

Edited November 24, 2008 by twix elbert

[sharxx101]

Its hard these days to do anything with new anti terrisom laws that protect all Police and take our rights away, as we are all considered to be terrorists now since 9-11. Not much you can do against these laws. There are new acts passed by all Governments every day that take more and more of our rights away. Sound like a scary future to me!

Edit: Cause I cant spell or type

Edited September 10, 2008 by sharxx101

[ballzac]

I agree with you ME, and I think it is way too open to abuse, but I just wanted to point out that the issue isn't quite as black and white as is being made out. However, I don't see how there is any reason to use a drug that causes amnesia.

[gromit]

yeah i think that decision should be the domain of qualified mental health experts, not any dick with a badge & a gun (or a syringe)

also cuffing of the hands (and feet if necessary) does significantly reduce them amount of self harm a person can do, they are designed that way.

quote - teotz

Who the FUCK are the Eagles?

maybe ben cousins tried it out and gave it the thumbs up :D

edit: i need to learn how to spell 'necessary' lol

Edited September 10, 2008 by --{ MAYJA }--

[Teotzlcoatl]

You put somebody in a staight jacket and a padded room if they are going to hurt themselves.

Simple.

I don't think you should ever give a human being drugs of any form without them knowing and willingly agreeing to taking them.

Edited September 10, 2008 by Teotz'

[Undergrounder]

i think if i were flipping out and a danger to myself and others i wouldn't mind if i were tranqualised.. the memory thing is weird though, no idea how they get a conviction after knowingly stuffing with someone's memory?

Doesn't seem like a big deal to me.

Now what is fucked up is that woman who was injected by that female Russian agent during the Kursk disaster. Like when she got up at a press conference and just started screaming at the authorities and a Russian agent came up from behind her and injected her, knocking her out, and led her away. It doesn't sound as bad as that though.

[MindExpansion]

UG, to me the worst thing about it isn't the idea (well it is because I bet they will be using it when they are a risk to others rather than just to themselves, for which a taser would suffice), but the potential for abuse (such as using it when someone isn't really a risk to themselves) and harm. I don't know if any confession they got would likely stick, written or otherwise, but it gives police too much extra power in my eyes...and even worse in my eyes is the danger to the person being injected. Drugs are given (in a medical setting) after extensive medical history taking unless in an emergency and even then possible risks are usually considered. I just think it is too risky for people, potentially less adequately trained, to be making those assessments in those situations.

[ThunderIdeal]

nobody has bothered mentioning yet that many cops are fuckheads. they physically assault CONSCIOUS people all the time. do you even want to imagine being knocked out, alone in a room with a cop?

[Auxin]

To be fair an emergency medic has to be there for the administration of the shot and (in an ideal world.. we all know how common those are) is to stay on site until the suspect wakes up and is out of danger of drug interactions, heart failure, respiratory collapse, allergy, etc., etc. So supposedly a police officer would not be alone with the suspect while s/he is unconscious. In practice who knows how well that is followed and cops are good at finding the right way to get away with shit. That leaves it wide open to abuse. For instance if there was some medical emergency going on where the EMT's were needed a cop could have a hot little teenage girl tranquilized, the cop would then convince the EMT's to make sure shes ok and go help others 'to serve the greater good'. The cop would then have ample opportunity to rape the young girl and plant drugs on her. Upon her waking shed have no memory of the events, and no witnesses, and while she may suspect she was raped she would be at the cops mercy over the planted drugs and could easily be convinced to stay quiet or face a possible 10-20 years in prison for having heroin in her school zone.

So while the system isnt set up blatantly crudely (medics are there) its still open to easy and extreme abuse.

[MindExpansion]

Auxin, I realised that that the EMT team had to be there but in my eyes that isn't really enough to have a heavy duty drug administered unless it is a true medical emergency. I would say the same if it was a doctor, the circumstances just aren't ideal... far from it in fact. Also, the fact that an EMT has to be there the whole time is a negative itself, because that is one less medically trained professional to help others, and many places (not sure about the states) are consistently short of medical staff.

Peace

[Auxin]

Yea thats a very important point, it ties up a EMT for a long time.. an EMT that could save the lives of 10 heart attack patients in that time.

The quality and quantity of emergency medics here in the states is highly variable and greatly dependent on the average income of the neighborhoods they service. See american ambulances charge the patients for every call and they can charge them anything they like within the realm of genuine possibility. They get to my house in 4 to 6 minutes and the service is very good, the blokes that service my area service the millionaires down the roads too.. a call costs about $600 USD ($750 AUD) plus any expenses like medicines ($8 AUD for an aspirin) but both times I had to call them it was worth it. In the slums they just cant get that kind of money from everyone- people are poor in the slums- so they get less ambulances, less EMT's, less experienced people, slower responce times, etc. A 4 minute call in rich town may take 30 minutes in poor town. Medical aid is not considered a right here, its a privilege/commodity, and they treat it accordingly.

...I wonder if the EMTs charge the suspect for the shot. The call, the shot, and then an hour of monitoring by the EMT's would cost as much as some people here earn in several months!

[MindExpansion]

$8 AUD for an aspirin

Holy shit! Wonder if they let you B.Y.O lol.

...I wonder if the EMTs charge the suspect for the shot. The call, the shot, and then an hour of monitoring by the EMT's would cost as much as some people here earn in several months!

Hah, from what I know about your medical system, it wouldn't surprise me.

Seriously though, the way your gov. has handled health care is pretty fucked up because it truly does neglect the less financially fortunate.

Peace

[jasemateau]

it does'nt erase your memory, it jusy knocks you out, just like falling asleep.

i mean when you wake up you dunno hoq long you've slept until you look at the clock...

it's not that bad, but this does not mean i agree that it's ok to use on the field, the post about the rape scenario is potentially very real.

i actually enjoyed it the 2 times i have had it!!!

but if anyone came near me on the street with a ringe i'd be yelling "i got alergies"!!!

i got allergies!!!!