My Loph to Pedro Graft

[Ace]

Ok guys - time to PANIC! What the hell is going on? I have had the rubber band off for about 5 days, watering occasionally, and now there appears to be a gap between one of the ribs...? WTF? Its like one rib has become detatched from the rest of the plant, but its still attached around the circumference. Sorry, the pics are hopeless - my camera doesnt seem any good on the closeups, but you can see the dark area in the grooves of the ribs. They are deep - I'd estimate about half the depth of the scion, but possibly right thru! Kinda hard to tell...

Any help would be greatly appreciated - is my graft DOOMED?!?!?! If not, what can I do to save her??

Thanks in advance

Ace

[gerbil]

Your camera can take close ups, but you need to play with it a bit, in the pics you are focussing on the pot media and the bench, but the loph is blurred, stand back a little bit and zoom to the graft. I still am pathetic with digi so take heaps of pictures with different adjustments (mainly physical i.e. move yourself back and forth distances) and then sift through to find the the good ones when uploaded to your PC.

Don't take it as truth, but it doesn't look good, possibly the orange type rot?? It doesn't look normal to have a dark/orange-ness coming out of the new growth, usually this will be a brighter green, but it's hard to tell from the pics. This is similar to what I talked about when I lost lophs to similar situations, it'll look fine, then you realise it's basically eaten from the inside out with little tunnels of the orange rot going through the cactus but expanding in areas to form a cavity of goo.

I think you could possibly be overwatering, the trich looks pretty plump and so does the loph, the graft will need time to settle down and when it starts to actively grow, then you can slowly increase watering. I've killed grafts so quickly by trying to baby them with water, at 5 days from band removal, I personally wouldn't have even watered once and just let it adjust, if it's got nowhere to send the water it'll rot IME.

I can't really offer too much advice other than stop overwatering and possibly keep it in a brightly lit, dry environment. Keep and eye on it, maybe try and get some better pictures, I'd possibly say do surgery but if it's rotten through that won't even help.

See what others say though, hope it works out for you

Edited February 7, 2007 by gerbil

[KlUe]

Mate unfortunately can't advise on correct action with that loph, but in regards to focusing the camera, try using macro mode.

If this isn't available or doesn't work for you, as gerbil said, try different shooting modes. I find with my digi cam that zooming in while taking the pic further away is better quality than taking the pic closer with the zoom out. But then again for those extra close shots I have a "super macro mode" which means I can basically have the lens touching the cacti and it'll focus perfectly.

[Ace]

Ahh crap - that was very well said Gerbil...

if it's got nowhere to send the water it'll rot

That could very well be the problem. Do you think its too late to maybe regraft? Possibly a couple areole grafts? Or would this just massacre it for nothing? I think its time to order a big bag of seed from SAB and try seedling grafts on my new peres... damn it!! Does anyone think she might make a comeback or are her days numbered?

[Ace]

And thanks for the camera tips folks - I will have to have a play this arvo and see if I have any luck. I dont think there is a manual zoom on it, or not that I have found. I better have a really good look... perhaps read the destructions

[Ace]

Ok, well to revive an old thread of mine, some bad news and some great news:

Graft didnt take - the scion rotted thru (tried some areole grafts too, but they rotted shortly after too) and I had to clean up the stock. I gave it the chop an inch above the base - both the top and bottom are now pupping and rooted nicely in the collection.

The root section of the loph has thrown a new growing tip! I have no idea how common/rare this is, but I've only ever seen lophs pup from the side areoles - not the meristem! I can only assume there was a little bit of the meristem still intact, and it has continued to grow from there.

Check her out:

She has been growing at a very fast rate - almost half the size of the original head, and its only been a couple months! I wouldnt be suprised if she flowers in the next few months - something I really would love to see I'm certainly glad I kept the rooted section intact and didnt do something as silly as throw it out!

It hasnt been under lights until now, it has been on a sunny windowsill, but as the temps are dropping, I've moved her under the warm lights to keep her growing. Is there anything wrong with keeping a cactus in a constant growth cycle year round?

Enjoy!

[ENtiTY]

Nice pics Ace, got the macro figured out eh

Thats seems to be some fairly rapid growth. Whatcha been feeding it, steroids? lol

[Ace]

Yeah, I just zoom in using the optical, and go as far as I can before the digital kicks in and then find a good distance from the object - seems to do the trick!

Nah, no roids - all water and once or twice I've given it a diluted seasol drink Pretty impressive in my books! Considering the loph was almost in slow motion before the attempted graft

[teonanacatl]

lol yeah you didnt get the meristem.

[Jesus On Peyote]

Mad post ace, i dident know much bout grafting but now i know it all!! (all i need to know)

Is there anything wrong with keeping a cactus in a constant growth cycle year round?

Iv had mine underlights for about 6 months now and they seem to be going good with no weird abnormality's.

Edited April 20, 2007 by Jesus On Peyote

[Ace]

Thanks JoP, I just wish the graft had have taken I guess its a good tek for what to avoid

At least it can go down in the record books for a bit of help in the grafting arena. I have plenty of seedlings that I hope to graft soonish, so I'll try and do a detailed tek for them too (hopefully with a bit more luck!).

[Rev]

dont freak

the graft will work or not worth

and most times if it doesnt work teh scion just forms roots anyway

better to leave them semi-attached till this happens

sometomes when just the parenchymal tissues fuse its enough to slow dehydration while roots form

[marsha]

that was a beautiful peyote why cut it off? cos it grows slow??? peyote grows slow deal with it fair enuff graft small pups or seedlings but why butcher healthy plants that were growing happily on own roots for an experiment??? we want to learn lessons from the plants maybe one lesson could simply be patience and respect..... i feel sick whats the rush???

[Ace]

Well, mostly because it was my plant and I chose to make a sacrifice in the hope of a big gain. It was a risk on my behalf. I lost out on the graft, but I was lucky to get the roots to re-grow a head, so it wasnt a complete waste. It wasnt just a rush for a big plant, but it was an effort for me to propegate a larger mass of these plants. They are an endangered species, and I am trying my hand at keeping them in cultivation.

Live and learn. I know they grow slow, this was an attempt in speeding things up, yes, but it certainly wasnt from a lack of respect. I had done a huge amount of reading and research before even contemplating such a project.

[marsha]

plant seeds and avoid grafting mature flowering age plants! grafting a single headed peyote to a pedro stock will do naught in the conservation of peyote ( tho grafting small pups seedlings and boosting plants to flowering size will) good luck with the cause over and out.... ps sorry if i seem cranky it just upsets me to see such beautiful plants chopped up with no real need

[Ace]

Sorry Yowie, I can see where you are coming from, and I agree and disagree with you at the same time. I quess another factor that promted me to do it - $. Or at least a lack thereof. I would love to have the money to collect a few specimens (not for sale, but for my collection), but at that point in time I didnt have such luxuries.

But on a good note, I daresay the new head on the rooted section will flower in the next couple months (I'd be suprised if theres still nothing in 6-12 months time). But alas, I still have no other lophs for cross polination (I did try self polinating this old girl before the failed graft attempt, but had 0 seeds after 2 attempts...), so I am still currently forced to propegate vegetatively.

But on another good note, I've just bought a 4cm loph off ebay, so I might have another flowering specimen for cross polination

Edit: The new girl - I hope she arrives sometime soon

Edited April 20, 2007 by Ace

[Ace]

And it must be noted, I have planted a few hundred cacti seeds over the past 6 months (both lophs, trichs and a couple other species) - so I hope this will aid in conservation

[Jesus On Peyote]

Is it legal\"right" to consevate a plant from another country? introduced?

Good luck with the seeds

[Ace]

Well, most of the plants (lophs) worldwide are from old wild specimens, or mostly from seed propegated plants. I dont think the law would prevent someone from trying to maintain a species from avoiding extinction.

Cheers!

[Rev]

ive mentioned it before but there no evidence that Peyote are endangered

some populatiions are or may even be extinct - like in the USA

but theres suggestion some of those are the result of human activity anyway, ancient peyote gardens gone native in Texas

for conservations sake you need to be growing diffusa, fricii, koehresii and the texan populations

Peyote is a very widespread plant, inlc very remote and inaccessible areas and very capable of holding its own if its habitat remains intact and only native harvesting practices are used.

Its not a hard plant to grow in culture either and in the right climate could easily and cheaply be 'ranched'. trout says 3 year old plants have sufficient chems to repel most wild animals - except goats - and are suitable for re-establishment efforts

what you did to that cactus was normal. that it grew back demonstrates how tough these plants are

ive noticed that except for wet feet rots, observations that peyote are very resistant to rot are spot on, prob due to all those antimicrobial compounds they have in them

this is my philosophy as a counter to that of precious conservation

it goes that its better to sacrifice a few individuals to learn what you need to to grow a dozen more

than to nervously guard a few relict plants from investigation

im confident if the peyote could speak english itd be happy with this offer. the nature of plants clonal abilities makes them less self oriented i see

weigh up the benefits vs risk

if you guess wrong the plant will grow back in time, youd have set it back several years and miss a fair bit of seed, and theres a small risk of total loss

but if you win you have created 2 cacti. the original mother and a new stock mother which will grow 300-500% faster and can be used to bear many more seed

it also prserevs that original planst genes so much better because now there are more clones so the chance of survival of catastrophe is higher by several degrees

its always best to go practice on an analogue species first. something with similar characteristics but more common

but if you are confident then go for it i say

while you are at it think about helping to conserve the many ariocarpus and turbinicarpus species at risk

Edited April 20, 2007 by Rev