kava extract???

[Andrew]

Hi Torsten

Is the kava extract,5:1 in the shop the same one HHH sells?One bottle was

equal to 80 grams.I was gonna try it,I love good kava,but i,m pretty sure I

remember the HHH price was $30.00 as opposed to $11.00 at SAB,and seeing as

I usually like to ingest about 100 grams at a time this was definately not worth it.

I might try SAB,s product though $11.00 for one kava session is still exspensive.

Anyone tried the extract and would like to post as to their experience with it?

Anyone know where I can get some good quality,full spectrum paste extract(70% -80%)?

[Torsten]

Not sure if this is the same as HHH.

It's not a very strong extract. It's great for noobs and those who don't like large volumes of gross tasting stuff, but it is probably not the best for experienced users.

[Μορφέας]

A good way to extract kava is to soak it in pure acetone, cap the bottle and warm it in some hot water for a while. Strain and air dry it to get some nice yellow crystals

[Torsten]

kavalactones are a yellow vicous liquid I think.....

[Μορφέας]

724ip.com has kava extracts at 80%, shipped from hongkong and takes western union...

[Torsten]

kava is a restricted import. If you import kava without a license you are importing an illegal drug. Private licenses are easy to get, but usually only issued for the impot of plain root powder/pieces.

Tepa, there are good reasons why the availability of kava is so poor in australia.

[Andrew]

Thanks for the reply,s

A good way to extract kava is to soak it in pure acetone, cap the bottle and warm it in some hot water for a while. Strain and air dry it to get some nice yellow crystals

I dont think this is a safe extraction because I dont think you can get rid of the

acetone completely,thanks anyway.

not the best forIt's not a very strong extract. It's great for noobs and those who don't like large volumes of gross tasting stuff, but it is probably experienced users

ok,sounds like I,ll just stick too the traditional method.Problem is the taste really gets

to me sometimes and the effects arent always reliable,probably my fault hurry,ing the prep.

I found this interesting http://www.freepatentsonline.com/6541044.pdf

Maybe I can build myself a Co2 extraction setup.Have to be careful though

playing with high temps and pressure,s.I,d really like to get 100 grams of effect but only

have to take a small amount of resin.

Anyone like to comment on their favourite varieties of kava.

I,ve tried vanuatan,fijian,hawaiin and new guinea and rank them in that order

as far as preference.What I look/feel for is euphoric effects.

[Torsten]

I dont think this is a safe extraction because I dont think you can get rid of the

acetone completely,thanks anyway.

Acetone isn't a problem. Your body has to deal with small amounts of acetone all the time and has enzymes to metabolise it. It's only a problem when you ingest it in large quantities. trace amounts are not an issue. I'd more more concerned about other residues in acetone. The stuff at bunnings [blue tins] is positively filthy. If you got some high grade [eg HPLC grade] acetone you would be fine.

[MORG]

Your body has to deal with small amounts of acetone all the time and has enzymes to metabolise it.

That's interesting... what are the sources?

[_e_]

i once had the unpleasure of being sucked into buying bulk kava and 'kratom' off a disreputable seller by the name of 'kavaman'.

He had great kavalactone powder, it was the only time i found kava 'easy' to work with (cept for torstens ega honey).

The powder was sort of like instant milkpowder but creamy orange/yellow

4 or 5g was absolutely blissfull... we combined it with some of the (real) kratom powder and had a very very euphoric, blissfull and sensual couple of weeks (that was legal in those days).

Too bad he stiffed so many of us with fake kratom... otherwise iw ould have loved ot have continued buying the kavalactone powder.

[Μορφέας]

The kava extract with acetone gives your smokable crystal like substance. Pure acetone is easy to get a hold of, You just gota go to a hardware store or a chemist and ask for some 100% acetone nail polish remover. Thats what its used for!

[Green Osiris]

kava is a restricted import. If you import kava without a license you are importing an illegal drug. Private licenses are easy to get, but usually only issued for the impot of plain root powder/pieces.

Oh shit, I've asked my mother to bring me back some kava roots from Fiji, is this going to create a customs problem ?

Feedback quickly would be nice, as she flies out of Fiji tomorrow morning, and I'll have to try and track her down at wherever she's staying to warn her if this will be an issue.

Fuck, imagine being responsible for getting one's own mum arrested

[Μορφέας]

Your aloud to bring in 3 kilo of Kava on a plane, You only need a liscence if your importing it through the mail. Make sure she only 'declares' 3 kilo, and keeps the rest a secret and youl be fine brother ;)

[teonanacatl]

The stuff at bunnings [blue tins]is positively filthy

Really? I found it quite clean....... maybe ill distill the whole tin.

Acetone is formed in the body during ketosis, hence fruity smell on diabetics breath.

[Torsten]

Pure acetone is easy to get a hold of, You just gota go to a hardware store or a chemist and ask for some 100% acetone nail polish remover. Thats what its used for!

No, this is tech grade and even though it says 100% on there it isn't. In fact I would be surprised if it is even close to 95% considering the large amount of water it contains. If it was 100%, why would labs pay 10 times the price to get just 99% pure acetone

The stuff in the blue tins [recochem?] at bunnings (labelled as 100% acetone !!) contains another organic compound that boils at about 70degC. It also evaporates MUCH slower than the acetone itself - ie, if you evap at 30degC with air movement you will retain much of this compound in your resin. It is bitter and has a distinct petrochemical taste, but little smell.

The diggers acetone used to be much better. Hardly any water and no organics residue.

[Torsten]

Your aloud to bring in 3 kilo of Kava on a plane, You only need a liscence if your importing it through the mail. Make sure she only 'declares' 3 kilo, and keeps the rest a secret and youl be fine brother ;)

It's 3 kilos or 3 months worth, whichever is the lower. So if she is bringing in a bag with instructions on it which idnicate it is more than 3 months worth, then make sure the instructions are removed. eg,. if the instructions say "use 100g once a week", then the limit would be about 1.2 kilos.

[teonanacatl]

damn typed a big reply and the comp had a fit so here is my much reduced reply.

Torsten all the kavalactones have a mp above 60, infact one has one at 60 the rest above 100.

How I would extract them:

1) Extract with EtOH or Acetone

2) Extract residue into DCM, ether or toluene (first two better here)

3) Wash organic layer with water a few times.

4) Dry and evap organic layer. See what the product looks like, if you wish to continue....

5) Wash residue with hexane/shellite, swirl it tritrate it grind it whilst hot, then cool in freezer and filter and collect the solid, its only to remove lipids. See what the product looks like, if you wish to continue....

6) Dissolve in minimal boiling EtOH or MeOH and let cool. If no crystals might have to add some water, drop by drop till cloudy whilst boiling then add EtOH untill it goes clear again and cool.

Two interesting ways to ppt them would be pour EtOH solution onto a small amount of water slowly, this forms two layers and when left the EtOH solution will diffuse and the kavalactones will ppt. Or dissolve in DCM and add a layer of hexane ontop and let diffuse.

Edited November 26, 2006 by teonanacatl

[Torsten]

Torsten all the kavalactones have a mp above 60, infact one has one at 60 the rest above 100.

Not sure how it works, but sometimes when you mix pure compounds which are both solids they end up a liquid or at least a goop. I have extracted kavalactones by making them water soluble and removing any non water soluble organics, then returnign them to the non-polar state and extracting them. Purity would have been extremely high [much higher than from resin extracts], yet they were a goopy mass.

btw, kavalactones don't dissolve in pet ether as far as I remember.

[teonanacatl]

Yeah mixing compounds can lower MP, hence the mixed MP methods used in labs for IDing unknowns. Its just a colligative properies things like salt in water or azeotropes. I actually hadnt thought about it occuring.

Edited to say:

The best way to imagine this effect is pure compounds form crystals when the molecules align in a certian way, when you have two or more compounds in a mix, especially when they are large like kavalactones unless they are perfectly aligned they will be a liquid or semi solid, like unsaturated fats in a membrane make it more fluid because they cant pack together well.

The effect will be over come if you put it in a freezer or if you added a little solvent and tritrate it (grind/rub it) you may get some bits to crystallise giving a solidy goop like some DMT.

Yup the shellite step is too remove any lipids from the goo leaving the kavalactones.

Edited November 25, 2006 by teonanacatl

[_e_]

Yeah mixing compounds can lower MP, hence the mixed MP methods used in labs for IDing unknowns. Its just a colligative properies things like salt in water or azeotropes. I actually hadnt thought about it occuring.

Yup the shellite step is too remove any lipids from the goo leaving the kavalactones.

theres some awesome info in here... almost worthy of the pharmo/chem section...

[Torsten]

The best way to imagine this effect is pure compounds form crystals when the molecules align in a certian way, when you have two or more compounds in a mix, especially when they are large like kavalactones unless they are perfectly aligned they will be a liquid or semi solid

Cool, that makes sense.

Yup the shellite step is too remove any lipids from the goo leaving the kavalactones.

Not in the second step it wasn't

2) Take up residue into DCM, ether or toluene (first two better here)

or if it was then you shouldn't have ehter in there as I am pretty sure ether will dissolve the free lactone.

[teonanacatl]

Yup the shellite step is too remove any lipids from the goo leaving the kavalactones.

Not in the second step it wasn't

2) Take up residue into DCM, ether or toluene (first two better here)

or if it was then you shouldn't have ehter in there as I am pretty sure ether will dissolve the free lactone.

Woah Im severly confused lol.

Pet ether and ether are different, kavalactones are soluble in ether but not pet ether (per ether= low bp hydrocarbons), Im sure you already know that T man.

So step 2 uses ether, dcm or toluene to dissolve any ether, dcm or toluene soluble components respectively which includes the kavalactones and lipids. Lipids are great at causing oily, waxy extracts so remove them by dissolving them in shellite, best way is dissolve hot then cool to cold (Unsure of solubility of kavalactones, I know they arnt very soluble but how in soluble I dont know hence the cooling), filter and keep the solids. The filtrate has the lipids in it.

I will edit my post following these definitions:

Extract= remove compounds your after into a solvent.

Wash = remove impurities from the compound your after into a solvent.

[Torsten]

sorry, I used the term pet ether where you used toluene. just substitute one for the other in my comment and it makes sense. Basically the hydrocarbons [whether cyclic or aliphatic] nor the toluene will dissolve the lactones.

I am also pretty sure DCM didn't work, but don't quote me on that. I didn't try ether, but I think it does work.

The lactones are easy to extract from a clean aqueous solution as they precipitate out into a goop or liquid and the water layer can be decanted. ie, the final step of the clean up is to liberate the lactone and then discard the water. no need for solvent.

[teonanacatl]

Oh lol yeah DCM and toluene were me guessing at easier to obtain solvents, figured one would have to be good. But if neither is good extraction solvent then they will be good washing solvents.

[SaBReT00tH]

So, the 16grams of extract (= to 80g of kava powder) in a single dose, will produce good effects generally?