Fractalhead

I've heard that the highest alkaloid levels in acacia generally occur during the peak of the growing season when there is plenty of water (ie. levels are low during long periods of drought such as during summer in the temporate areas and winter in the tropics and subtropics.

Certain members of the convolulaceae have been found to produce nortropane alkaloids (eg. calystegines) in the roots only. Could the smoking of roots be a clue? Personally, I'd be very suprised if the actives in convolvulaceae smoke were ergolines. Surely they would be disintegrated by the heat.

So how low is this baseline T? It sounds like its high time for an LC/MS time course experiment If the drop-off does equilibrate to a stable baseline this could suggest that the decrease in potency could be the result of a shift in metabolic equilibrium between the seed on the vine and off the vine. Perhaps there is actual enzymatic metabolism going on in the seed once its picked and the fold decrease in potency depends on the starting levels of certain enzymatic substrates at the point of harvest. Alternatively, there may be more than one major active, one more stable than the other. The final baseline activity (and degradation curve) may depend on the initial ratios of the actives which in turn may depend on genetics and/or epigenetic factors. Hmmm interesting stuff... looks like I might have to re-investigate

quote: Or is the name just an indication of its alkaloid content? yes. Hehe. If there are still Fractal seeds out there, they are best planted in the ground so that they can grow into plants with seeds showing alkaloid profiles that warrant the name. The freshest original 'Fractal' seed is about two years old now and therefore more or less devoid of goodness (unless someone out there worked out some kind of preservation process I wonder if anyone has any seeding plants from those yet???

Yeah tort re apiol - that's what i was thinking. Theres also the tetramethoxy allylbenzene in there two. While we're on the topic of oils... does anyone have any putative myristicin containing Zieria sub species samples they want checked do they? I'll swap you a free analysis for the GPS coords As you pointed out Tort it would be good to get some w/v breakdowns. As much as it would be nice to have standards to make standard curves on the GC/MS, I think a more readily attainable way would be to set up my GC/FID More soon...

Hehe. Wow!! so many willing participants... Yes I think that absta(i?)nence would be a good scientifically responsible thing to maintain in the week or so prior to the experiment. Maybe the more energetically inclined lab rats could even do some vigorous muscular exercise and we can compare their stats with the couch cruisers' Who knows, we might even come up with some novel mass spectra... So Tort, do you reckon refined parsley would be a satisfactory substitute? I remember you saying something about vertigo after some refined dill oil. Something about the tetra-subs? Also T, what kind of dose do you think would be a good starting point in terms of dose if we're assuming a 90% w/v myristicin oil? I've got that paper from Sasha where they achieve a mild effect from 400mg myristicin but I'm not sure whether they knew about your exercise theory in those days Maybe we can do two experiments with different doses. This is going to be fun! Fractal

Torsten, just glancing over your analysis it looks like you came to the same conclusions I did... except for the bit about their being no elemicin. The mace oil definitely had 'some' elemicin. Unfortunately, at the threshold settings I ran that nist search on, there wasn't quite enough signal from elemicin to be included in the search. I actually injected a very dilute solution of the oil in methanol. If I'd changed the settings or upped the sample concentration elemicin would have turned up for sure. I found a peak after myristicin that was very small and did a manual search that hit elemicin with a high match score. This same peak has turned up in just about every myristica oil analysed so far. There are def differences in the ratios of the three main allylbenzenes (s, m and e) in different oils but every oil i've tested now (about 5 or six), the myristicin peak is about 5-10 fold larger than the S peak. When I have time I'll collate all the data and post it up. So if there were some Myrista sp. essential oil 'high boiling fraction' available, who might be interested? Who knows, maybe you can get some cash back when you send your 'mid-party' urine sample back to me so I can analyse it for metabolites that might provide some clues as to the metabolic pathways going on. No seriously, if i get some refined oils together, would anyone be interested in being involved in a big community science experiment? I'm thinking if people each pay a certain amount of money to take part and then I send out a sample of refined nutmeg oil (with all the nasty lighter boiling crap like pinene etc removed). To encourage everyone to send back a urine sample, I could send back some extra treats when I receive the urine sample (no rude practical jokes please . Some of the money will go towards buying the disposable solid phase liquid extractors that will concentrate all the basic metabolites prior to analysis. If we all work together we could really nail this metabolic nutmeg madness once and for all

ohhh man! ad i thought you had some new mass spectrometry database for us ;(

Hi Tort, I've analysed those Myristica sp. ois of yours on a gc/ms. Am I right in guessing that one of them was mace and one of them nutmeg oil. You were very cryptic with your M and N labelling I guess it was a nice example of a blind study... I'll post the library search qualitative reports below: HERE is the 'N' oil data: Pk# RT Area% Library/ID Ref# CAS# Qual _____________________________________________________________________________ 1 5.98 15.63 D:DatabaseNIST02.L 1R-.alpha.-Pinene 15161 007785-70-8 90 1S-.alpha.-Pinene 15160 007785-26-4 87 Cyclohexene, 4-methylene-1-(1-meth 15299 000099-84-3 81 ylethyl)- 2 6.04 26.91 D:DatabaseNIST02.L 1R-.alpha.-Pinene 15163 007785-70-8 95 1R-.alpha.-Pinene 15161 007785-70-8 95 Bicyclo[3.1.1]hept-2-ene, 2,6,6-tr 15351 002437-95-8 93 imethyl-, (.+/-.)- 3 6.36 6.02 D:DatabaseNIST02.L Bicyclo[3.1.0]hex-2-ene, 4-methyl- 15349 028634-89-1 91 1-(1-methylethyl)- Bicyclo[3.1.0]hexane, 4-methylene- 15348 003387-41-5 91 1-(1-methylethyl)- Bicyclo[3.1.0]hexane, 4-methylene- 15354 003387-41-5 91 1-(1-methylethyl)- 4 6.46 19.40 D:DatabaseNIST02.L .beta.-Phellandrene 15173 000555-10-2 90 .beta.-Pinene 15150 000127-91-3 81 Cyclohexane, 1-methylene-4-(1-meth 15307 000499-97-8 80 ylethenyl)- 5 6.97 11.07 D:DatabaseNIST02.L Limonene 15127 000138-86-3 52 Cyclohexanol, 2-methyl-5-(1-methyl 25625 000619-01-2 38 ethenyl)- 1,3,7-Octatriene, 3,7-dimethyl- 15218 000502-99-8 38 6 7.18 2.86 D:DatabaseNIST02.L 3-Carene 15131 013466-78-9 42 1,4-Cyclohexadiene, 1-methyl-4-(1- 15330 000099-85-4 42 methylethyl)- Cyclohexene, 1-methyl-5-(1-methyle 15336 001461-27-4 42 thenyl)-, ®- 7 7.77 1.29 D:DatabaseNIST02.L Pentafluoropropionic acid, pentade 149597 1000280-07-5 58 cyl ester Pentafluoropropionic acid, octadec 159526 1000280-07-7 49 yl ester 1-Dodecanol, 3,7,11-trimethyl- 75210 006750-34-1 49 8 8.30 4.28 D:DatabaseNIST02.L 3-Cyclohexen-1-ol, 4-methyl-1-(1-m 25652 000562-74-3 90 ethylethyl)- 3-Cyclohexen-1-ol, 4-methyl-1-(1-m 25686 020126-76-5 87 ethylethyl)-, ®- 3-Cyclohexen-1-ol, 4-methyl-1-(1-m 25683 020126-76-5 76 ethylethyl)-, ®- 9 9.16 1.69 D:DatabaseNIST02.L 1,3-Benzodioxole, 5-(2-propenyl)- 30384 000094-59-7 92 1,3-Benzodioxole, 5-(1-propenyl)- 30379 000120-58-1 91 1,3-Benzodioxole, 5-(1-propenyl)- 30382 000120-58-1 91 10 10.68 10.85 D:DatabaseNIST02.L 1,3-Benzodioxole, 4-methoxy-6-(2-p 50186 000607-91-0 92 ropenyl)- 1,3-Benzodioxole, 4-methoxy-6-(2-p 50187 000607-91-0 91 ropenyl)- 1,3-Benzodioxole, 4-methoxy-6-(2-p 50188 000607-91-0 89 ropenyl)- and here id the 'M' oil: Pk# RT Area% Library/ID Ref# CAS# Qual _____________________________________________________________________________ 1 5.98 20.45 D:DatabaseNIST02.L 1R-.alpha.-Pinene 15161 007785-70-8 95 1S-.alpha.-Pinene 15160 007785-26-4 94 Bicyclo[3.1.1]hept-2-ene, 3,6,6-tr 15289 004889-83-2 91 imethyl- 2 6.37 4.57 D:DatabaseNIST02.L Bicyclo[3.1.0]hex-2-ene, 4-methyl- 15349 028634-89-1 87 1-(1-methylethyl)- Bicyclo[3.1.0]hexane, 4-methylene- 15354 003387-41-5 87 1-(1-methylethyl)- 1S-.alpha.-Pinene 15160 007785-26-4 83 3 6.46 21.75 D:DatabaseNIST02.L .beta.-Pinene 15146 000127-91-3 91 Cyclohexene, 4-methylene-1-(1-meth 15299 000099-84-3 91 ylethyl)- 1R-.alpha.-Pinene 15161 007785-70-8 86 4 6.79 3.10 D:DatabaseNIST02.L 1,4-Cyclohexadiene, 1-methyl-4-(1- 15330 000099-85-4 87 methylethyl)- Cyclohexene, 4-methyl-3-(1-methyle 15308 099805-90-0 86 thylidene)- Bicyclo[4.1.0]hept-3-ene, 3,7,7-tr 15344 000498-15-7 60 imethyl-, (1S)- 5 6.87 2.21 D:DatabaseNIST02.L Benzene, 4-ethyl-1,2-dimethyl- 14364 000934-80-5 42 Benzene, 1-methyl-2-(1-methylethyl 14406 000527-84-4 38 )- Benzene, 1-methyl-4-(1-methylethyl 14401 000099-87-6 38 )- 6 6.91 3.36 D:DatabaseNIST02.L Cyclohexene, 1-methyl-4-(1-methyle 15340 005989-54-8 49 thenyl)-, (S)- Limonene 15128 000138-86-3 46 D-Limonene 15136 005989-27-5 41 7 6.95 8.88 D:DatabaseNIST02.L Cyclohexene, 1-methyl-5-(1-methyle 15288 013898-73-2 55 thenyl)- 1,3,7-Octatriene, 3,7-dimethyl- 15218 000502-99-8 45 1S-.alpha.-Pinene 15160 007785-26-4 38 8 7.18 4.23 D:DatabaseNIST02.L Bicyclo[4.1.0]hept-3-ene, 3,7,7-tr 15344 000498-15-7 55 imethyl-, (1S)- 1,4-Cyclohexadiene, 1-methyl-4-(1- 15329 000099-85-4 55 methylethyl)- 1,4-Cyclohexadiene, 1-methyl-4-(1- 15330 000099-85-4 55 methylethyl)- 9 7.44 3.49 D:DatabaseNIST02.L Silane, trichlorodocosyl- 163388 007325-84-0 30 3-Hexadecyloxycarbonyl-5-(2-hydrox 158227 1000222-82-8 22 yethyl)-4-methylimidazolium ion Pentadecane, 1-bromo- 111968 000629-72-1 18 10 8.30 6.48 D:DatabaseNIST02.L 3-Cyclohexen-1-ol, 4-methyl-1-(1-m 25686 020126-76-5 87 ethylethyl)-, ®- 3-Cyclohexen-1-ol, 4-methyl-1-(1-m 25683 020126-76-5 87 ethylethyl)-, ®- 3-Cyclohexen-1-ol, 4-methyl-1-(1-m 25654 000562-74-3 87 ethylethyl)- 11 8.40 1.19 D:DatabaseNIST02.L 5-Dodecene, (E)- 34726 007206-16-8 25 Heptafluorobutyric acid,n-tridecyl 155417 1000216-78-9 25 ester Heptafluorobutyric acid, n-tetrade 158317 007365-36-8 25 cyl ester 12 9.16 2.38 D:DatabaseNIST02.L 1,3-Benzodioxole, 5-(1-propenyl)- 30379 000120-58-1 94 1,3-Benzodioxole, 5-(1-propenyl)- 30382 000120-58-1 94 1,3-Benzodioxole, 5-(2-propenyl)- 30384 000094-59-7 93 13 10.22 1.18 D:DatabaseNIST02.L Decane 18419 000124-18-5 30 1,4-Benzenediamine, N,N'-diethyl- 31788 003010-30-8 30 Benzenemethanol, 4-(1,1-dimethylet 31873 000877-65-6 30 hyl)- 14 10.69 15.58 D:DatabaseNIST02.L 1,3-Benzodioxole, 4-methoxy-6-(2-p 50186 000607-91-0 96 ropenyl)- 1,3-Benzodioxole, 4-methoxy-6-(2-p 50187 000607-91-0 96 ropenyl)- 1,3-Benzodioxole, 4-methoxy-6-(2-p 50188 000607-91-0 90 ropenyl)- 15 11.10 1.15 D:DatabaseNIST02.L Cyclopropane, 1-butyl-2-pentyl-, t 34843 074663-87-9 42 rans- 4-Heptafluorobutyryloxyhexadecane 162900 1000282-97-2 38 5-Undecene, (E)- 25825 000764-97-6 38 I hope you can all make sense of that. Please people note that % in this case relates to a percentage of a particular peak means the percentage of the total area under the total ion chromatogram (TIC) not the percentage makeup of the oil in % mass. Anyone who wants to view the raw data is welcome to email me and I'll email you the raw data file so you can scan the data files with your own personal library. There are definitely a few peaks in there that don't match anything on the standard library. Check out the low match scores out of 100. So if you have any ideas what these unknowns might be you could run some standards and add the mass spectra to your library. I've discovered much to my disappointment that NIST02 doesn't contain croweacin. However, it does have croweacic acid. I think croweacin matches myristicin to some degree. We might get a strong hit to croweacic acid if we pre-oxidise our oil with permanganate...

So how do people feel about remarriage after a partner is deceased? As much as I would like my wife to be have a happy life, I have to admit that on one level, if I died I would be really seriously rolling in my grave if I found out that some lucky living bastard was screwing my wife while I was on the other side. Also, those of you who are believers in monogamy, what is the longest period of time you have been physically separated from your darling? After my wife and I fell in love (we'd been together for about 4 months) we agreed to commit to one another and spend the rest of our lives together. Then shortly after this we parted (physical) ways and she stayed in qld while I moved to perth to start a uni course. We had agreed that she would come over to perth for a holiday (at least initially only a holiday) one year later. I would have to say that this was probably the most depressing period of my life so far. She ended up coming over in six months and let me tell you, I thought a LOT about love, fidelity and trust during that six months. With a LOT of love, trust, admiration, respect, confidence in the future of our relationship... and well lets face it, a little help from my hand, I stayed true to my wife. However, I think the most important inspiration for staying on track was a deep sense of spiritual connection with her such that I knew we were meant to be together and that there were very special things in store for us if we were smart enough to put the effort in and stay together long enough to find out what they were. I think that this sense of connection is due at least in part to a series of rather full-on coincidences and symbols that happened/appeared to each other in visions before we had met one another and then immediately recognised (much to our shock) after talking to one another about our experiences prior to finding each other. These shared visions occured both on psychedelics and while straight and awake as well as during dreams. I remember we had a strong sense of "everything else has been leading to this". Now I see our relationship like an thrilling novel where a new exciting spirituo-sexual twist could happen at any moment and I just can't bear to put the book down

Hey Horatio, Did you remember to type your complete username (ie. [email protected]) rather than just the nick 'xxxxx'? I almost fell into this trap when trying to log onto the new system on someone elses computer. Now I can't get the login page to load up on my computer which is running IE 6.0.299. I can get past that first little pop-up by clicking OK but then I get the message: "ERROR: requested URL could not be retrieved" in the title bar and "

I just logged onto the new email system to discover a couple of strange emails from [email protected] and [email protected] telling me for two different reasons to open up a 42k .zip attachment file. I'm very suspicious of these emails and as much as I don't want to lose my SAB email account, I don't want to unwittingly invite viruses into my system. Are these emails for real?? While we're on the topic of spam, is there any way to block all this crap that is flooding my SAB account? Here's the first one: Subject: Email Account Suspension From: [email protected] Date: Wed, June 29, 2005 7:05 pm To: [email protected] Priority: Normal Options: View Full Header | View Printable Version Dear user fractal, It has come to our attention that your Shaman-australis User Profile ( x ) records are out of date. For further details see the attached document. Thank you for using Shaman-australis! The Shaman-australis Support Team and the second one: Subject: IMPORTANT NOTIFICATION From: [email protected] Date: Thu, June 30, 2005 2:04 pm To: [email protected] Priority: Normal Options: View Full Header | View Printable Version Dear Shaman-australis Member, Your e-mail account was used to send a huge amount of unsolicited spam messages during the recent week. If you could please take 5-10 minutes out of your online experience and confirm the attached document so you will not run into any future problems with the online service. If you choose to ignore our request, you leave us no choice but to cancel your membership. Virtually yours, The Shaman-australis Support Team +++ Attachment: No Virus found +++ Shaman-australis Antivirus - www.shaman-australis.com Download this as a file Attachments: document.zip 42 k [ application/octet-stream ] +++ Attachment: No Virus (Clean) +++ Shaman-australis Antivirus - www.shaman-australis.com

Firstly, even when different experimenters try to use the same solvent system in different laboratories, absolute Rf values can be quite variable since it is difficult to reproduce all the other factors that affect absolute Rf such as condition of the plates (eg. level of dryness), saturation level of the atmosphere inside the development chamber, temperature etc. Even when measures have been taken to control these parameters, absolute Rfs can be quite variable. What is usually more helpful is looking at the relative distances travelled by different spots and comparing these to the relative values of Rf reported in the literature in which many standards have been run alongside one another in the same lab under exactly the same conditions. This info can help you pinpoint the compound of interest in a complex plant extract so that you can then use that extract as a kind of standard to look for the same compound in a completely different mixture coming from another plant. This approach is easiest when the typical pattern of spots obtained from a given species has been well mapped and validated with the use of standards (eg. HBWR or P. harmala) but more difficult when no such map is available and you can only get a single Rf for the compound without much to compare it to.

Hi ppl, The purpose of this thread is to gauge what interest there might be amongst the community in obtaining materials for conducting thin layer chromatography (TLC) analyses. For those of you who don't know, TLC is an analytical technique for the qualitative and semi-quantitative analysis of chemical mixtures (eg. essential oils, alkaloid extracts, biodiesel etc). You can get a great rundown on the basic TLC procedure here: TLC Procedure This technique could not only be used for quality control or to find new sources of known active compounds but coupled with chemical fractionation and bioassay, TLC could help us pinpoint new substances worthy of thorough chemical examination. Some of the beauties of the technique are its affordability, ease, rapidity and portability (highly applicable to analysis in the field). If there is enough interest, I'll see what I can do about making TLC kits available for sale. These kits would basically consist of TLC plates, detection reagents, capillaries, pipettes, beakers and test tubes (for sample prep). Other components such as solvents, reagent sprayers, UV lamps etc are readily available throughout australia and it would be pointless me offering to provide them. Please let me know if any of you are interested.

BTW... I can definitely put you together a kit if you want one. Just email me to line something up.

Thats an excellent idea foolsbreath and something I have been trying to get around to for some time now. Which standards do you have in mind? Maybe we should start something along the lines of the Australasian Free Standard Ring (AFStR)... I certainly don'e have time to prepare every standard people might like. These standards don't have to be pure compounds or solutions of pure compounds but may be well characterised mixtures. As long as we have some kind of benchmark. Looks like I need to start offering some small volumetric flasks and some volumetric capillaries... There are a few challenges with this standards based approach however. Firstly is the instability of many of the cooler compounds. Secondly is the legality of many of the cooler compounds. These things make to trade or possession of some standards a little tricky. In these cases, we may have little choice but to use relative Rfs and colour reactions for identification.However these problems only cover the minority of potential standards. Bring it on... I will offer a few standards as soon as I can - GC/MS verified where possible

Hi DL I think PP pointed out most of the components i was going to mention. I've got some more specific info for you too but I want to check my notes first. I should write back in the next few days. I've been looking into the financial feasibility of setting up a semi-preparative HPLC out of old salvaged and bought secondhand bits and pieces. Unfortunately, even thinking about HPLC seems to somehow suck money out of your bank account and i need about $3k to set up a simple system from bits and pieces i already have. That's a lot of school fees to spend on an expensive toy... Any investors out there ???? I've worked out that the best bet is to ask around at old laboratories that have been using hplc systems for a long time and hence have lots of old redundant bits and pieces taking up space. Most old hplc components are cross compatible between brands etc in terms of plumbing. Its just when you want to set up electronic communication between different compononents and a computer that trouble arises. You mentioned that you would like to set up a preparative system. A true prep system requires a preparative pump that is capable of maintaining high flow rates even against large back pressures. While these offer the ability to separate hundreds of mg or even grams of material at hplc resolution, these are very very expensive and not very commonly available cheaply from secondhand suppliers. You might be surprised, however, just how much material you can separate with a normal 'analytical' hplc. Quite often you will be able to separate 10s of mg with the right size column and injector configuration. This is quite a bit of material for many applications. GC is extremely useful aswell but that comes with its own can of worms, again (funnily enough) mostly the type of worms that are easily satisfied with 1000's of $$ Not really any cheaper to set up or run and involves having cylinders of potentially explosive gas sitting around. I would aim for HPLC first just because it is simpler mechanically and electronically, you can more easily assemble a system from lots of different scavenged parts and you might be able to sell the eluents to help pay for the mainenance of the system. Anyway, I'll dig up some more specific specs for you soon.

Hi guys. I've finally got my shit together and tested out the use of methylated spirits for the purposes of making up Ehrlichs and Vanillin detection reagents for TLC. Just as I suspected, metho works perfectly. These reagents are extremely sensitive (ie. you can detect minute amounts of compound with very small amounts of reagent) so you should be able to make the 500 mg of each that come with the kits go a long, long way. It is best to make up these solutions fresh each day since they don't keep very well. I was introduced to a really cool method for using these recently: 1. In a CLEAN vial or test tube, dissolve a matchhead or so of the reagent in ~200-500 ul of metho and add a 2-3 drops of conc. HCl (hardware store grade is fine). Mix. 2. On a CLEAN surface (eg. a watchglass) saturate a piece of filter paper (that has been cut to a size slightly smaller than the TLC plate to be detected) with a few drops of the reagent solution so it is moist but not dripping all over the place. 3. After the TLC run, let the solvent system evaporate off the silica and then carefully push the plate silica face down onto the saturated filter paper. It is easiest to place one end down first and then smooth the rest of the plate down by running your finger down the plate. Make sure the plate surface is in even contact with the filter paper and within a few seconds, remove the plate from the filter paper in the reverse fashion (try not to damage the layer by sliding it all over the filter paper). 4. IMMEDIATELY hold the plate over a heat source such as an electric hotplate or stove (better to use tweezers or forceps or pliars etc. rather than touch the plate and reagent with fingers). It is important to do this immediately in order to evaporate the ethanol and prevent diffusion of your spots. The heat will speed up the colour reaction. The spots should appear within a few seconds. You aren't trying to char the plates so don't put the plate on the stove but hold it up above the heat source. You'll know when its warm enough So there you go. Sorry for taking so long, but I've been in limbo for the past couple of months. Looking forward to hearing some more feedback. Please et us know how you go! Cheers, Fractal

Yeah I've felt funny for a little while after accidently getting a nose full of husk powder while cleaning HBWR. Quite a subtle almost placebo effect. In fact, I could only describe the effects as either the mildest hallucinogen experience or the most psychedelic placebo experience i've ever had. To be honest it was too subtle for me to compare it to qualitatively with any oral HBWR reports i've read but definitely a dreamy maybe slightly visual feel. Also kind of stimulating and mood enhancing. Although, it was a beautiful night wasn't it, buddy - i had fun running around the field like a loony while gazing up at the stars thanks for reminding me guys...

Hi Rev, Yeah we have managed to keep a few cuttings going but we seem to have a problem with our rutaceae going nuts for a while before suddenly going brown and then dead all within the space of a couple of days. Unfortunately I think this happened to the ones you wanted but we will try again from new plants. You can do a solvent extract if you just want to get a feel for the likely profile of the steam distilled oil. However, you should bear in mind that you may extract some of the more non-volatile stuff and hence the mixture may be a bit more complex. I would recommend a low polarity solvent like hexane. For pure oils, you need less than a few ul diluted into 1 or 2 ml of solvent to do heaps of analyses. For the solvent extraction its harder to say (not having done it) but I would guess a few hundred mg of tissue ground in a couple of ml of hexane and filtered would be a good starting point. It would probably be a good idea to centrifuge this prior to injection to avoid injecting particulates into the instrument. I know of people using this kind of method to analyse oil plants. I will check their protocol and get back to you. The actual injected sample is usually only about 1 ul. Sounds like we have no shortage of things to grow and analyse

Sorry I've had a lot going on and haven't had a chance to do it quite yet. I will do my best to get around to it this weekend.

Thanks for that info Entheo. I'd love to get my horticultural hands on a lot of those Zieria chemotypes. There certainly are some nice smelling ones I checked back over the raw gcms data for the parsley oil and interestingly, there was a decent peak with about the right retention time for apiol and only gave a pretty poor match with anything in the ms library (i think it was a really old nist(98) library). So that peak could well have been apiol if apiol wasn't in the library (didn't have time to check). I need to search against a more comprehensive library. Checked some Melaleuca bracteata oil as well and found both a litle bit of anethole and fair bit of methyl eugenol. Definitely no elemicin . So the search is still on for the elemicin rich M. bracteata.

Torsten I just emailed the details to you via the little 'Email Torsten' button above your post. It says you kept your email address private but let me type the email into a message box. I hope this works. I'm sure it can't be too hard to get a pure myristicin standard from one of the chem supply companies. But I don't think it is really neccessary for GCMS especially if you run a few myristicin containing plants through and compare retention times aswell as spectra. I didn't get any apiol hits in the parsley oil but I will check the data again to see if it could have been missed for some reason.

Torsten, I just ran some of the nutmeg oil you gave me at EB03 (for the TLC workshops) through a GC/MS and myristicin is definitely a major component (the myristicin peak area was about 40% of the total ion chromatogram). I should point out however that this doesn't mean that the oil is 40% myristicin. We won't know the accurate % makeup until we run these oils through a GC fitted with an FID detector. Elemicin, safrol, eugenol, isoeugenol, methyl eugenol and methyl isoeugenol were also present albeit at much lower concentrations than the myristicin. Can you remember if this was the good oil that has been used successfully in massage experiments? BTW, I also ran some 'Gumleaf Essentials' nutmeg oil using the same program and got almost the same amount of myristicin and very similar overall profile. The parsley oil you also gave me for the workshops was virtually devoid of myristicin compared to the nutmeg oils. I'm guessing this oil was distilled from parsley foliage rather than the seeds. All in all a very interesting day in the lab If you can get me a sample of this new putatively good oil(s) by early next week I might be able to run them through aswell for a comparison. [ 06. May 2005, 13:25: Message edited by: Fractalhead ]

The emission spectrum (which is what i think you mean by 'absorbance', teo) of all your common fluorescent tube blacklights has a characteristic peak at a wavelength of around 365-366 nm. This type of UV is often just called longwave UV as opposed to 254 nm UV which is referred to as shortwave UV. Unlike 254 nm UV, 366 nm UV will not excite the fluorescent indicator that is impregnated into the TLC plate layer but will cause many fluorescent compounds (many indoles) to glow. Hebrew, you can order whenever you like. Unless it all dies in the arse, this should be an ongoing thing and the kits should be available for months (if not years) to come. Teo, regarding the use of white methylated spirits to replace 96% ethanol in the making up of vanillin and ehrlichs detection reagents- I've been meaning to try this out so I can add it as a hint on the ethnowiki. I am 99% sure this would work fine but until I try it myself I would be reluctant to advise it in case you waste your reagent - of course you can try it if you want I will do it in the next week or so and report back. You can get away with a pump action sprayer if needs be. As long as it is not too wasteful and creates a nice fine even mist. I've even seen a pipette used to pipette the reagent onto the surface of the plate and it worked acceptably.