Jump to content
The Corroboree
Torsten

D beats the system

Recommended Posts

This text has been posted on various forums, websites and emails and is the very happy conclusion to a dramatic case. However, as good as this news is, it has caused a bit of confusion among people. Please read the text first and then my notes at the bottom.

============================================

Great outcome for Ayahuasca court case in Australia. 6th-08-05

Those who have been following D's court case in Australia over the last 12 months will be very happy about the findings in the Lismore local court yesterdays. Australian, D jumped on by a 7 car drug squad with dogs guns the works. was originally charged with Importing Prohibited Narcotics , namely DMT and Harmine. He was also charged with dealing a schedule one substance. He was put on $100,000 bail. and spent 3 days locked up. He was looking down the barrel of 10 to 20 years in Jail. Then the magic started to happen. Was it the plants or the spirits that work with the plants or maybe the focused beems of love? who Knows. but for some strange reason the police prosecutors started dropping the charges. Sure it was only a bottle of ayahuasca, a shamanic potion of 2 amazon plants used for millennia for all sorts of positive reasons. It was not a white powder made in a laboratory for financial gain.

As we sat breathless while the magistrate read a D's "glowing" references and we beamed him love I could see he was starting to get what this was really about. The Magistrate virtually apologised for the ordeal that such a well respected community man as he had to endure since his arrest. He said there would be NO FINE AND NO RECORDED CONVICTION. HIS ONLY PUNISHMENT WAS A 2 YEAR GOOD BEHAVIOUR BOND with $500 self assurity that he only has to pay if he is naughty over those 2 years. People usually get more than that for being caught with Pot.

So what does this mean for Ayahuasca use in OZ? or importing? Its still technically illegal but a precedent has been set that makes the punishment for importing and even use fairly unimportant as far as the law goes. So what is the big difference between USA and OZ. The High court intervened in the USA to keep Ayahuasca illegal.

=======================================

The problem with this case is that it is a one off and has no bearing on any other future or current case. Some will dispute this and I encourage anyone to seek proper legal advice before relying on any such information.

The main issue here is that people claim a legal precendent has been set. I remember from issues unrelated to ethnobotany that legal precedents are only set by district and appeals courts, and court higher than this. D's case was dealt with by a magistrate and it is my understanding that there is no such thing as legal precedent at this level. In fact, each magistrate is able to make a 100% independent decision on each case's merit and they will not (officially) consider the decisions of other magistrates.

This means this case has NO effect on anyone else getting busted for the same/similar thing. ie, if you get done for the same offence then even the same magistrate is under no obligation to hand down a sentence that resembles D's. Other magistrates would be totally oblivious to the case and I doubt that legal representation would even attempt to make comparisons in court.

So sadly, while this is great news for D, this changes nothing about the legal situation that ayahuasca is in.

Furthermore, anyone thinking this case provides them some protection, please consider that not everyone has access to the type of lawyer d had.

This was not the 'ayahuasca test case' a lot of people had hoped it would be and the sort of case we desperately need in australia. One cannot blame D for that. With the kind of potential penalty he was facing (10 to 25 years) I can't see many people having the guts to make a political point. Sadly, the only way this political point will be made is when someone gets busted and does not get the lenient penalty D received. If you have already received a 15 years jail term from a magistrate then the choice to challenge this in a higher court (and hence set a valid legal precedent) is really the only option. However, hardly any person in australia would have the type of cultural defence that D had and that would be needed for a clear ayahuasca victory, so the odds really are still very much against ayahuasca. So if you are intent on importing any ayahuasca herbs or brews you should definitely lay the groundwork by becoming active in one of the ayahuasca spiritual groups. This will be the best defence for you and the best defence for ayahuasca itself.

[ 15. September 2005, 17:53: Message edited by: Torsten ]

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Have just done some research on legal precedent law and this has pretty much confirmed my previous understanding.

The way case law (legal precedent) works is that lower courts are bound by legal precedent of a court that is higher than them. They are not bound by case law from courts equal to them or in a different hierachy.

Thus, a magistrate is bound by district/supreme court and various appelate levels (eg a full bench appeal is superior to a single judge appeal). However only supreme courts of that state are recognised. hence a NSW supreme court precedent has no effect on a Qld magistrate.

The states have separate hierachies which are independent, however the states do have to follow precedent of federal courts if these are higher up the hierachy. eg a NSW supreme court is bound by the australian High Court precedents.

So it is not that magistrates have no power to set precedents, it's just that there is no court level below them that the precedent is valid for. The effect is the same though, and a magistrates decision has nor bearing on another magistrate.

What we need is for an ayahuasca case to go into appeal. It doesn't sound like D nor his prosecutor have such intentions, so we are still at square one.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

still makes me want to cry with joy that an innocent man was NOT punished. yes he did commit an offence and did recieve an ear flick, but this shows that the legal system here is not as bad as one first imagined.

i would imagine it would be a differnt story all together if he was frequently abusing the plants or refining them into purities for sale. then i would expect the shit to hit the fan, but that wasnt the case so it wasnt treated as such. thats a marvel to me :D :D :D :D :D

!!!I am overjoyed at his freedom!!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Great result , as for a test case surely it can't be that dificult to get one moving considering the level of popular support ?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

one interesting thing that came out of this case was the leading officers comments regarding 5-meo0dmt...

a gnome in the hills told me that the leading officer made an offhand comment somewhere along the line of "but its still not illegal to import 5meo".....is this the case?>??

i surely would have thought it to be covered in analogue laws but ive been searching for hours without finding mention to anything other then nndmt....ill advised cop? or opportunity to have some fun??

someone please fill me in here... or send me links to relevent analogues legislation

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

5MeODMT IS an analog of DMT and hence covered under customs import analogs. It would also be covered under the respective state analogs if not scheduled specifically.

Cops aren't the brightest, so don't expect them to know the details of the law. However, the fact that he didn't know is a good sign, because to get busted someone must first twig onto the issue.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ayahuasca is a vine from the Amazon typically used for healing and personal transformation... nobody should have any fear about the law regarding ayahuasca... and I believe people should freely import ayahuasca in any form they see fit in order to facilitate their own personal growth and transformation.

BUT, if you are not prepared to stand up in court for your beliefs, you are a Chicken Shit and deserve to remain unhealed and untransformed!

Julian.

Edited by folias

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Of course, precedents are easily overturned by lower courts in any case by finding a significant reason as to why the precedent should not be applied. Such reasons can be manufactured as easily as political spin. Also, whilst precedents from lower or other state courts may not be binding, they certainly are still of persuasive use when arguing your case.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A man who won't die for something is not fit to live.

- Martin Luther King, Jr.

An individual has not started living until he can rise above the narrow confines of his individualistic concerns to the broader concerns of all humanity.

- Martin Luther King, Jr.

An individual who breaks a law that conscience tells him is unjust, and who willingly accepts the penalty of imprisonment in order to arouse the conscience of the community over its injustice, is in reality expressing the highest respect for the law.

- Martin Luther King, Jr.

Every man must decide whether he will walk in the light of creative altruism or in the darkness of destructive selfishness.

- Martin Luther King, Jr.

Freedom is never voluntarily given by the oppressor; it must be demanded by the oppressed.

- Martin Luther King, Jr.

Human salvation lies in the hands of the creatively maladjusted.

- Martin Luther King, Jr.

Law and order exist for the purpose of establishing justice, and... when they fail to do this purpose they become dangerously structured dams that block the flow of social progress.

- Martin Luther King, Jr.

The hope of a secure and livable world lies with disciplined nonconformists who are dedicated to justice, peace and brotherhood.

-Martin Luther King, Jr.

The question is not whether we will be extremist but what kind of extremist will we be.

- Martin Luther King, Jr.

When you are right you cannot be too radical; when you are wrong, you cannot be too conservative.

- Martin Luther King, Jr.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes tis' a pity this case was not tried in a higher court..Magistrates rulings are not going to get you far if you use them as precedents in a higher court...that's not to say you shouldn't stick your lawyers nose in the direction of D's case, but don't be relying on it brothers and sisters..we still need a case that's tried higher up to gain some sort of steady ground.

This is the information needed to be put forward in any case. Its a healing tonic prepared at home for religious and spiritual guidance, and therefore not a commercial viability for sale or abuse. Its never produced in any more than single dose quantities and rarely ever used again by the user after healing has taken place.

I thought this bit of the text a little odd...was originally charged with Importing Prohibited Narcotics , namely DMT and Harmine. He was also charged with dealing a schedule one substance. He was put on $100,000 bail. and spent 3 days locked up.

Why is anyone importing any of the "aya" ingredients when it appears as though they are readily available with Australia..?...have to wonder about that part of the charge..!

H.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There are vast differences between ayahuasca vine that is 100 hundred years old compared to vine that is 4 years old say... plus, there isn't that much quantity of vine growing in Australia that is mature enough.

Julian.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
BUT, if you are not prepared to stand up in court for your beliefs, you are a Chicken Shit and deserve to remain unhealed and untransformed!

Julian.

Heh.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
There are vast differences between ayahuasca vine that is 100 hundred years old compared to vine that is 4 years old say... plus, there isn't that much quantity of vine growing in Australia that is mature enough.

Yes, obviously, but the impression I have is that the potency is also greatly associated with the people that participate.

In other words, the overall effect on the group could be enhanced by efforts of meditation.

I recall Sasha mentioning something similar in relation to a San Pedro ceremony in which two

groups had the same brew but completely different effects.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

LOL I remember someone years ago telling me that the reason such differences existed was because the atomic bond lengths in DMT were slightly different between different speices of mother plants. I won't say who...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

hey look, lots of people deserve the healing power of plants... but I'm just hearing of so many people kow towing to the system in fear, especially in regards to ayahuasca, which I find really ridiculous... it's one of those things, if you are ever found with by the cops, you should be honoured to be so lucky to have an oppurtunity to show the law to be silly and progress the dialogue!

That is what I seriously think... its not good enough to be yet another little fear filled colonialist ready to be smited by the keystone cops and the beurocrazy handed to them by the powers that be... that perspective, is of course, rubbish and that is how we should treat it, in my opinion.

Julian.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Its really quite sad when you look at what type of people we are here and, the quiet passive happy lives we all want to lead..when every day you wake up and have fear..its like an evil insidious desease that lurks in your mind stressing you daily and filling your eyes and minds with paranoia...all because we want to respect nature and listen to the winds and actually give a shit about earth. Everyday I venture out in the crappy wide world of shopping centres and traffic etc..I have fear..and Im not even doing anything wrong..its the fact that the keytstone kops can piece together shit like intent..is just appalling..So I want to grow some exotic plants and admire them and understand all about them..but the authorities wanna say no you just fuckin stop that and go and watch footy and pay ya house of and work like a dog so our capitalist machine can continue to barge its way across the environment for our smiling happy ever expanding shithole subdivisions.

these fuckers should be thanking us for taking the time to preserve some of these plants before the machine pulverizes another hectare of wilderness and leaves the following generations with nothing but books about such magical plants.

I hate having to live in fear cause I chose the life I have allways felt comfortable with..it sux it really does.

H.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ideals are fantastic, and i agree with you in theory julian, but how do you suppose to address the issue of situation specific cases.

To me it seems these sorts of convictions have the potential to hinder specific paths in life that many people are involved in:

- family issues and custody cases with children

- Job prospects, specific science research directions

- overseas travel

etc.

It is rubbish, and as much as i would like ideals (or even just practical reality), it seems people are involved in situations above in which such a stance on laws could very well work out negatively for these 'chicken shit' individuals.

can see your point though.

hey look, lots of people deserve the healing power of plants... but I'm just hearing of so many people kow towing to the system in fear, especially in regards to ayahuasca, which I find really ridiculous... it's one of those things, if you are ever found with by the cops, you should be honoured to be so lucky to have an oppurtunity to show the law to be silly and progress the dialogue!

That is what I seriously think... its not good enough to be yet another little fear filled colonialist ready to be smited by the keystone cops and the beurocrazy handed to them by the powers that be... that perspective, is of course, rubbish and that is how we should treat it, in my opinion.

Julian.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No wonder his circles are so damn secretive...this system is retarded

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×