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watering lophophora


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#1 Pseudo Mexican

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 09:47 AM

hey there, I have a few lophs here and I live in a coastal area that rarely gets below 10 degrees in winter. do I need to stop watering the lophs in winter?

#2 Sally

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Posted 01 May 2012 - 11:38 AM

How big/old are they and what are growing in ?
Is that day time temp or night time ?

When in doubt underwater them.

Younger plants will need a bit more watering, but established Lophs really need to go through a dry cycle, especially in winter when their metabolism slows down.
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#3 trucha

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Posted 02 May 2012 - 02:28 AM

Agreed with SallyD as far as container cultivation goes.
I'm not clear though if 10 is C or F? A 10 degree low will commonly be fatal if it is 10F but 10C might actually encourage some winter watering to happen.
In the wild Lophophora williamsii in South Texas commonly gets a lot of rain during winter -- including heavy rain during freezing weather dropping into the low 20ºsF which is around -6.7ºC and above. In a container that is likely to bring death but in the ground it is a different story..
See the last two images on the page at http://www.cactuscon...h/freezing.html for an example.
Winters in South Texas are typically mild though and it does not freeze hard every year nor does it ever stay freezing for very long.
Drought periods are important if a person wants to grow plants like can be found in nature. Recurrent periods of drought, especially during warm weather, will mimic their natural conditions and produce Lophophora specimens that much more like those that occur in the wild.

#4 Pseudo Mexican

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Posted 04 May 2012 - 10:44 PM

thanks for the responses. I have about 20 seedlings that are half a year old, each just under a cm in diameter. I also have one large approx 4 year old one, that is almost 4cm in diameter. Night temperature in winter is lowest 8 degrees celsius. However, they are on my windowsill and still get 4 hours of direct sunlight in the morning get indirect sunlight day.

around what month should I stop giving it water and when shall i start watering constantly again?

this is the first year I've grown lophophora.

#5 trucha

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Posted 05 May 2012 - 09:45 AM

I'd suggest early enough so that they go into winter with dry soil. (And bear in mind the plants are going to expel water into the soil in preparation for winter)
When I lived in Texas I'd typically stop watering my cacti at some point in September since the first freeze usually did not happen until some point in November or later.
I'd resume when flowering or growth was noticed (usually by the beginning of March)
However, with a Winter low of 8C you really have little need to care about a reasonable amount of wet and cold causing death just too much water producing unnaturally pampered plants.
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#6 Pseudo Mexican

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Posted 05 May 2012 - 10:45 AM

great advice trucha!

I think it is more likely they will die of pampering - they are my babies!

cheers

#7 BBGONE

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 04:18 AM

They can live without wintering and be happy.
The only thing you need is T5 fluorescent lights.
110 W U - tubes is enough for 6 good sized plants.
They can grow all througth winter, under lamps.
And if you fertilize them, then you can get mature cacties 6 times faster.
And they are even better than in nature.

#8 zelly

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 05:10 AM

They can live without wintering and be happy.


Have you personally communicated with your cactus plants and asked them their feelings on being forced to grow though their naturally dormant periods? You may be happy, but I sincerely doubt your plants are. :wink:

And if you fertilize them, then you can get mature cacties 6 times faster.
And they are even better than in nature.


Better from who's perspective? :wink:

Kinda reminds me of Kobe beef, you know, the cows that are cooped up in pens, fed beer & massaged daily, or ducks & geese being force fed for the delicacy known as fois-gras.

At one time these plants were regarded as sacred & used strictly in religious sacramental contexts. Now days it seems they are exploited for other far less honorable purposes.

It's a damn shame mankind has remained basically ignorant in learning to communicate with the plant kingdom.
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#9 Evil Genius

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 05:19 AM

Btw, no discussion about "better" cacti allowed here. Im getting tired of constantly telling this to new members. Rules are pinned in like 3 Threads. Read them!

Edited by Evil Genius, 06 May 2012 - 05:52 AM.

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#10 BBGONE

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 10:03 AM

Have you personally communicated with your cactus plants and asked them their feelings on being forced to grow though their naturally dormant periods? You may be happy, but I sincerely doubt your plants are. :wink:


People also are eating fabricated food, and seems are more happy to do it:)
They also don't live in caves, they grow cows and pigs for their food purposes.
They use growing plants under artificial lights all year round. Because they have intelect, and they can use
(after some experiments) some traits of plants for their purposes.
People also use pills to treat diseases, which earlier were untreatable. And life expectancy now much longer, than a hundred years ago.
Dont you use the modern things?
If you dont like modern things, you can not use them, and live in a cave, and eat raw food, dont take pills or ointments to treat a disease.

and so plants can benefit from the modern things. Of course if someone takes them from nature to the peoples habitat to grow them in pots.


Plants can give you hints, happy they are or not from their appearance, growth rate, and health.
And I dont think plants care much about sacred they are or not.
They need energy (light) and food (nutrients), and they will not grow better if you will worship them.

People think that these plants are sacred and exterminated large population of cacties for their sacrednes.
Plants would be more happy if they are not sacred.
At least they live in a such case longer and these plants existed long before mankind got existent.

Edited by BBGONE, 06 May 2012 - 02:40 PM.


#11 BBGONE

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 10:38 AM

Btw, no discussion about "better" cacti allowed here. Im getting tired of constantly telling this to new members. Rules are pinned in like 3 Threads. Read them!

In my case "better" means bigger and healthy plants.
Dont know what the others mean by better:)

Edited by BBGONE, 06 May 2012 - 02:33 PM.


#12 applesnail

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 12:09 PM

grow em like a coyote wandering the desert in search of water....

#13 qualia

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Posted 06 May 2012 - 12:30 PM

i haven't watered mine for a month or so, i probably won't water them until september or something now.
i think i read somewhere before that they'll soak up moisture from the air?
dunno how true that is.
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#14 BBGONE

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Posted 07 May 2012 - 08:53 AM

Some interesting info about Lophs. watering (in summer):
Unlike so many articles I have read that say water your plants once a year,
only if there is a full moon, only water with water that has run over a naked virgin etc
(I am left wondering how many of these plants the authors have actually grown)
Lophophora can take a lot of watering growing in this soil mix, rainwater is best but tap water is also fine.
Due to shortage of space, for the last 2 years we have grown the plants outside for the entire growing season (UK)
with last year (2005) being one of the wettest on record.
The plants were out with no protection from April until October with the soil wet almost every day of the season.
The result: healthy fat plants with a much better colouring than those grown in the glasshouses and with no pests.
The plants were fed with a 12.5-25-25 fertilizer, every two - three weeks - available from our store.
After these amazing results, I will continue growing them this way.

from http://www.divinecac...cultivation.php

And this is excerpt from another growin experience: http://www.bcss.org....154293&start=20
The Lophophora obtained from seed grow relatively quickly on their roots.
If fertilizer is provided regularly, it grow fast.

Picture of his Lophs sowed in March 2010
made in November 2011 (he used fertilizer "flortis" once in every two waterings. Composition: NPK 4-6-8+B+Cu+Mn+Zn
He used half the recommended amount (he added 5 ml of fertilizer per liter of water).
This corresponds to 200 mg of Nitrogen per liter of water.
)

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Edited by BBGONE, 07 May 2012 - 09:29 AM.


#15 Sally

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Posted 07 May 2012 - 09:17 AM

^ Are they yours in the pic BBGONE ?

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#16 BBGONE

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Posted 07 May 2012 - 09:32 AM

I'd be glad to have them but they are not mine.

Edited by BBGONE, 07 May 2012 - 09:41 AM.


#17 trucha

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Posted 07 May 2012 - 09:45 AM

Its true that with heavy watering and frequent fertilizing faster growth will occur and plants will be seriously pumped and glowing. (Add in some benomyl and a person can actually give them a low dose of soluble fertilizer with every watering and they will grow great without rotting.) Lophophora is one of the most water tolerant out of the globulars.
On the other side, they will look much more like one encounters in nature with regular drought periods and minimal feeding. No water at all for 6-9 (or even more) months out of the year is quite common in nature.
Some people prefer plants in their collections that look more like wild ones and others like plants that are pumped up to their full vegetative potential. Neither one is wrong, its just a matter of preference.
A friend of mine (now dead) raised bonsai trees that he collected from nature and then kept rootpruned. All were in pots yet any time there was a major storm he insisted he had to break at least one branch on each in order to keep them "natural".
One would never see Lophos in the wild that look like many of those that exist in older German and Czech collections but despite their divergence from a natural look I'm always impressed by those amazingly beautiful huge and heavily tufted monsters. So often they are living works of art.
Its good to grow plants one enjoys looking at and being around. Really the grower's enjoyment of what they are doing should be the main guide to what they do and how they do it.
Some people actually destroy or eliminate any cactus in their hands that is not perfect or that does not perform adequately in flowering. Harry Johnson reported that most of his Paramount hybrid attempts went into his compost pile rather than being offered to the public. If they did not look great, grow vigorously and flower reliably profusely he said that he did not want them to exist. To each their own.

I know an NAC person who is deeply disturbed at the thought of those "poor peyotes" living in Czech greenhouses all pumped and plump but I prefer to think the species is just taking an extended luxurious European vacation until such a time as its diversity of genetics there might be needed back home.

Edited by trucha, 07 May 2012 - 09:46 AM.

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#18 zelly

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Posted 07 May 2012 - 11:08 AM

deeply disturbed at the thought of those "poor peyotes" all pumped and plump


Deeply disturbing pictures :wink: :P

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#19 trucha

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Posted 07 May 2012 - 01:44 PM

Gotta love those lopho lovers.

#20 planthelper

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Posted 09 May 2012 - 09:44 AM

how much you water your lophs over winter depends on your daytime maximum temps, and not your minimum temps.
my lophs get watered heaps over winter, because the soil still dries out quite fast with my setup.
if your soil stays moist for quite a while after waterings than you have to, change the soil and the setup. watering less, doesn't solve the problem entirely.
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#21 zelly

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Posted 09 May 2012 - 12:03 PM

how much you water your lophs over winter depends on your daytime maximum temps, and not your minimum temps.


pardon my french, but i call bullshit.

regardless of how well draining your soil is, watering lophs with ambient night time temps below freezing is highly inadvisable.

#22 planthelper

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Posted 09 May 2012 - 02:18 PM

hey there, I have a few lophs here and I live in a coastal area that rarely gets below 10 degrees in winter. do I need to stop watering the lophs in winter?

pardon my french, but i call bullshit.

regardless of how well draining your soil is, watering lophs with ambient night time temps below freezing is highly inadvisable.




get your facts right, topicstarter say's around 10 deg celcius.

don't make up your own story, mate, you are the bull shiter here, no one said freezing!!!

10 deg is not freezing!!!

Edited by planthelper, 09 May 2012 - 02:19 PM.

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#23 zelly

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Posted 10 May 2012 - 01:22 AM

PH- my comment was aimed at your post & your post alone. Did you not observe that I quoted that which I was responding to, & not anything the OP posted?

Since you did not quote the OP, your statement of

how much you water your lophs over winter depends on your daytime maximum temps, and not your minimum temps.

appears to be standing on its own merit.

Since you failed to quote anybody's post, how can the average reader know who you are responding to, if anybody, or if you are just throwing out your own 2 cents worth of general knowledge?

Besides, there's a whole lot more to the equation than ambient temps, for one there's this little factor called dormancy, brought on by shorter days & longer nights.

The OP sounds like he's just getting his feet wet in growing cactus plants, and the very best advice anybody can give him regarding watering his plants is that it's virtually impossible to kill his plants by failing to water in a timely fashion.

Considering he has 20 seedlings 1 cm in diameter & most likely potted in pots far too big for them, those 20 could easily go 2-3 months with no water whatsoever.
In reality, these plants do best when the soil is allowed to dry out completely between waterings, most especially during dormancy periods.

#24 trucha

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Posted 31 January 2014 - 12:42 AM

If cactus soil stays moist in between waterings I'd suggest the soil needs changing to something with less water retention capacity. Less organic materials and less water are two suggestions that can often resolve a host of common troubles.


Edited by trucha, 31 January 2014 - 12:42 AM.

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#25 incognito

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Posted 01 February 2014 - 08:33 PM

I'm not to fussed with my lophs. I've been watering then daily in this crazy 40degree heat we are having lately. Mine are outside in full sun, all year round. I feed them spring and autumn generously with blood and home and liquid ferts, and repot every third year. I hold of watering over winter completely, they still get whatever naturAl rainfall comes there way.

They certainly are a very tough plant.
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