39 replies to this topic

[planthelper]

very interressting wood dragon, do you know the story of the kenilworth toad? a toad discovered only years ago and became extinct soon after the discovery. it could have given us new medicines, as this toad could controll the ph of it's gastric fluids. and it's said it was wiped out by this fungus.

i don't introduce fish or any aquatic animals into other water way's, i put them only in my containers, and they come from an area only a few metres away from my home.

[Amazonian]

Hey PH, i am having trouble coming up with any info on a kenilworth toad. There were some 'gastric brooding frogs' around some time ago that could do the same thing, change the ph of the digestion. They would swallow their eggs, and brood the tadpoles in their stomach until froglets emerged... Amazing stuff. They are now apparently extinct. i was led to believe that it was due to a number of things including over research and pathogens. There was Rheobatrachus vitellinus and Rheobatrachus silus. Both became extinct around the mid '80s. Possibly the same frog that you are talking about planthelper ?

Nature is Amazing


Back on topic... Your lotus looks happy.
Disregard the attached file below, I added photo instead, cant edit it out

Attached Files

•  R.silus.bmp   148.4K   1 downloads

Edited by Amazonian, 01 May 2011 - 04:03 PM.

[WoodDragon]

PH,

Yep, you're referring to the two Rheobatrachus species.

Unfortunately I never had the chance to see them live, although I spent a few years looking.

They were almost certainly wiped out by chytrid. The genus Taudactylus, which shared a very similar range to Rheobatrachus, has mostly gone the same way.

[planthelper]

wau, you guy's must be university professors or something similar, great info!

yes, i meant this toad, i read a book about it, but don't recall the tilte of this book (noosa library had it), i used to live in noosa and eumundi and had friends in kenilworth....

i love this side track, because after all it shows us that, the threat of us humans making species extinct before we learn what benefits they have to offer, is very, very real. i always underestimated this fact, and i guess most people do the same, and it was this stomach breeding toad which made me aware, that those dangers are real.
we might could have cured ulcers and ibs and other complaints with this toad...

[random]

ugh edited as I keep losing the top half of my post. Anyway,

What are the minimum requirements for a container pond in which to grow this plant?
The container pictured looks quite small, which is encouraging as it might mean that I will be able to grow it in my backyard.

eg how many litres?


Re the gorgeous amphibian(s), if only people hadn't been so selfish as to want to use the toad for their own benefits then it may still be alive, that is to say, if it was over-researching that ended up contributing to the extinction of this poor creature...

Poor thing.

Edited by meeka, 02 May 2011 - 02:13 PM.

[Amazonian]

wau, you guy's must be university professors or something similar,

ha , Professor Amazonian does have a nice ring to it, but alas, i am a mere housewife with a love of frogs. I was a member of a frog group for a while, where i got rub shoulders with a few 'big frog people' and learnt some neat stuff.
With all your plant knowledge , you are the real master here planthelper.

Re the gorgeous amphibian(s), if only people hadn't been so selfish as to want to use the toad for their own benefits then it may still be alive, that is to say, if it was over-researching that ended up contributing to the extinction of this poor creature...

The over research is just one of my theories for the extinction of the Gastric Brooding Frogs. Apparently, there were many collected for research . Maybe they were at the brink of extinction at the time of the discovery and they were just pushed over the edge with no return. At first , the ones who discovered the Gastric Brooding Frogs thought the frog was eating its young. Truly Amazing Frog.

Edited by Amazonian, 02 May 2011 - 02:53 PM.

[WoodDragon]

Ironically, there hadn't been that much research disturbance of Reobratrachus in the field.

The problem was that they all dropped off their perches in the space of a couple of years, probably because people (lay and/or scientific) curious about their sudden notoriety in the media brought the fungus into their catchments, or did so in the several years before their unique life history was discovered. The SE part of Queensland has many species of public and scientific interest, and before chytrid was even hinted at there was no protocol devised (or understood to be needed) to keep the transmission of the fungus to an absolute minimum.

There were still frogs to be easily found in the streams even though there had certainly been some collected - the sudden disappearance isn't explained by the collection for study.

Aside from some collection, the frogs were known and mostly left alone for almost a decade, before their peculiar brooding method was discovered... Then in the late 70s some live animals were being sent from one researcher to another for basic taxonomic work, and when the eskie was opened at the destination there were more frogs in it than were originally packed. It took a little while to figure out that the female was actually regurgitating her young, but once it was realised that they were actually caring for their tadpoles in their stomachs there was an explosion of scientific interest, especially because the Helicobacter pylori cause of most ulcers was not yet understood.

There was certainly more collection at that point, but the fate of the frog had already been sealed, and they died out in their natural environment before anyone knew it was happening, and before any need for a captive population was appreciated.

Sadly, there are many more ecological time bombs ticking, but they almost never gain prominence until after they've exploded.

Edited by WoodDragon, 02 May 2011 - 07:22 PM.

[random]

Thanks for the detailed information Amazonian and WoodDragon, a truly amazing amphibian, a little tiny part of me would like to believe that there are still more hiding somewhere in some forgotten wilderness.

[WoodDragon]

A brief description of lotus growing in an Australian context.

A US site discussing growth from rhizomes.

A very nice diary of growing from seed.

Some good tips.

An Australian supplier.

A few more tips.

[planthelper]

ugh edited as I keep losing the top half of my post. Anyway,

What are the minimum requirements for a container pond in which to grow this plant?
The container pictured looks quite small, which is encouraging as it might mean that I will be able to grow it in my backyard.

eg how many litres?


Poor thing.

that container only measured 20 or 25 l, and as said i have alreadu put the lotus in a bigger container by now.

anyway, i have seen lotus, blooming very happy, in even smaller containers regarding the surface area, but they had aswell at leasy 25l capacety, they were urn shaped ceramics.

aswell there are some miniture forms of lotus on the market, and i'm sure they would be happy growing even in a small container, if well maintained.
flowering lotus looks awesome in a a nice ceramic container!

[planthelper]

those seeds did not germ, nice spec thogh.  K3094DFC0AE9_1000070nelubo pod.JPG   680.95K   2 downloads

[planthelper]

20. feb 2012, i place some pink and white sab store bought lotus seeds into small water containers.
previously i used an angle grinder to scarify the sides of each seed.
i grinded only briefly, and changed over to the next seed, very frequently, so not to heat up the seed to much (but maybe the seeds don't car about the heat, but better be safe than sorry).
the last few "grinds" i did by hand sanding, with a good quality abrasive paper.

23. feb 2012, to my amazement the seeds started to germinate already!!
i had changed the water, once every day. i inspected the few seeds which, did not show any signs of germinating, and divided them into two catagories, one is the "soft to the touch seeds" and the 2nd the "still hard to the touch seeds".
all the seeds which had started to green up, to this moment, were "hard to the touch" and so i disected a soft seed, with the diagnose that, it was rottin a bit, and would have never germinated.

so i removed all the soft seeds, because they fouled the water.

this morning, the 24th, i could already observe, that a small leaf is forming on the end of the green leaf stalk!!
i reduced the water level so that the leaf will be able to reach the surface, in given time.
i still exchange the water every day.

as always, some wonderfull things always seem to happen in the garden when you need them the most (a neighbours tree, fell onto my ethno trees and dragon fruit vine).

in a nutshell, growing lotus from seed, i highly recommand it!

[planthelper]

and here are the pics!
 sab nelumbo.JPG   656.81K   6 downloads

just a few day's later.
 nelumbo sprouting.JPG   724.97K   7 downloads

it's getting longer, 1st time i've done that.
 it\'s growing.JPG   522.65K   6 downloads

more pics, if it's growing.

[planthelper]

i was lucky to transfer many of the seedlings to some of my water features.
this setup kills mozzies!
i got duckweed, waterchestnuts and lotus.  SAM_0935 (800x600).jpg   418.68K   8 downloads

[Amazonian]

Looking good planthelper. I had some problems with aquatic snails hey, they ate a good part of the stem of Lotus seedlings i have growing. . I am hoping they recover.