white light

[hebrew]

jono dosage

this is what i do weather it is something that will work for you i dont know

i take .5 - 1 gram powder in the morning, sometimes take the same amount at night, best take on emtpy stomach, i usually dont froth it, just mix with water and ingest

however if you feel like frothing heres how you do it according to manton hirst, a xhosa initiate

Firstly, the root material. For the best effects, well developed roots are essential. I would avoid the powdered crap I notice is being sold on the Internet at ridiculous prices. As soon as one crushes some plant material, it's chemistry will start to oxidize. And if powdered material has been laying round somewhere, even sealed in a bottle, it is something less than it was before it was crushed. Healers always keep material in root form for good reason. Our current research shows that stored plant material degrades rapidly over time. Dose 250-500mg of the powdered root. It should be properly dried (sun dried is best). Secondly, the finely ground material must be mixed in at least 500ml to 1 liter water and beaten up with a forked stick. A hand held or electric mixer is useless because all the ground particles adhere to the mixer. Pharmacological research on the root at the moment indicates that there is more chemical load in the water fraction than in the dry or oil fraction - novel acids and probably diterpenoids are present. Although the dreams are particularly vivid, this is not exactly an hallucinogenic experience. Regard it more as a clicking back to normal night time dream mode. One is supposed to fill one's empty gut with as much of the white foam, which is produced by vigorous mixing, as possible. A Xhosa initiate is never finished drinking from the can until he/she belches. This is repeated three times a day for three days at full moon. No psychedelic effects ensue. One might perhaps notice a sudden sharpening of one's intuition, though. Just at night when one sleeps, one is going to dream like Rip van Winkel (ever heard of that dude?). Use the medicine for about three months, as described, and you'll never need to use it again. On the psychological level, the dreams are very resolving of current problems and issues.

[incognito]

thanks so much VS. You are the bestest!

could you point me toward some good sites? do you have any docos regarding the dream herbs in your sexy dvd cache?

fuk it im just gonna call you, im excited about Ubulawu as well!

[hebrew]

no i dont have any dvds man

or good sites

best thing is to take the plant and learn from it that way.

[toast]

some people put ubulawu herbs into capsules and swallow them on empty tummy first thing in the morning. you then wait till you get hungry and eat carefully. eating too soon will make you puke as most ubulawus are also strong emetics [due to the saponins].

The traditional method is to shake the powder up in some water until it forms a froth [200ml water in a 1L water bottle works well]. You then consume ONLY the froth as this is what contains the saponins. The same food rules apply as this is also emetic.

Effects starts usually after 2 or 3 days of consumption as it is cumulative. So no need to take large doses and make yourself unwell - just take it for more days.

Just wondering if you have any other suggestions for dosing 'White Light'

eg how much per day if consuming incapsules

thanks

[hebrew]

i havent tried the white light yet waiting to get over a sickness before i start workign with it, but i would start dosing the same as silene and get used to the plant mix, and then ask the plant to show me how to dose prepare and create ceremony for this plant, and wait for it to present in a dream.

this is how i learnt to work with silene, and most any plant i take.

i wouldnt worry abotu capsules, i would froth it or take with water. i think the taste of the herbs is in important element to working with plants, in chinese medicine the taste is an important facet to the plant and its properties

anyway please report back any effects from the white light

[drugo]

I've been trying to make some time for trying White Light. I've had a 7g gar for a while now and want to start experimenting but first I have a coupla' questions which I'm hoping you might be able to help clarify.

Do the actives have any effects whilst awake (despite short-lasting nausea)?

-will I be able to maintain my usual everyday activities? or should I organise a few days to spare?

Is a recommended dose of .5g - 1g for morning and night or just morning?

How effective is the froth extraction?

How long are we meant to shake for? How many 'pulls' or froth extractions are necessary?

-I'm leaning towards simply ingesting the herbs out of fear of frothing failure.

Edited September 5, 2009 by mooksha

[t st tantra]

my experiences are in another thread.though i seemed to get more extreme results than most do.i suspect there are interactions with other things.after the second daily dose it kicked in full time....a slightly altered but functional state 24hrs a day....insomnia became intense,my normal reaction to dream herbs....there seems to be a formula or similar in that if you take it for x days it can take a further x days to wear off totally....in my case 3 or 4 days of silene took a week to wear off once i stopped dosing....but i am known to be super sensitive to some things...

t s t .

[Teljkon]

dfgdg

Edited December 19, 2021 by Teljkon

[Thelema]

Ive never really crossed your path thelema but you seem to have a thorn in your side for the whole lot of anyone in unconventional ethnobotony

Hmm. Yeah pretty easy to see that you haven't really been following my contribution over the last 6 years. The question that I posed to Torsten has been sorted out both publically and privately: namely, I was too eager to pin upon him unscrupulousness, and he agreed with me that in a perfect world ingredients of novel shamanics should be declared.

So where do you fit in? Some guy re-activating the debate 1 month later?-LOSER.

I can't let such a demonic attack upon me go, however, without addressing some of the whinges this guy makes:

you have some built up ideal that your doing science only when sampling new ingredients and your better than others because of that.

I might mention that this last postulated motive is nonsense; there seems to be some confusion between the idea of "new" and "undeclared" ingredients. Scientific analysis can be done on anything that is "undeclared". I would love to do an an analysis of the white-light dream mixture, for example, but I have just ordered 5 ubulawu roots from south africa, each separated into their own bags, and I can do it that way; which makes me happy, because I can begin to connect the dots; ratiocinate the effects with the limited but known chemistry of each ingredient. And you might ask "what the hell is wrong with that?" - there is nothing wrong with it. Some people like a distant african shaman, who might just be some fat-necked zulu, gathering some herbs and selling them as dream mix. Personally, I like to get them seperate so I can elucidate the effects one by one, and in combination - and yes, there's no guarantee that some fat necked zulu aint doing that too. That's just the way I have been intellectually trained.

As far as negative effects go If anyone uses any ethnobotanical and has negative effects they should discontinue use permanatly untill a profesional opinion from a doc is recieved.

And what information could you give a professional doc? Ha you've shot yourself in the foot here! The amount of info you could give is exactly the amount of info you know about what you've ingested!

You're a "little cockroach"-don't realize that ultimately the Doctors aren't there to save you from the unknown:

The "big cockroaches" know that we're all against the unknown together!

Edited September 7, 2009 by Thelema

[Teljkon]

dfgdfg

Edited December 19, 2021 by Teljkon

[Bush Turkey]

Man i wanna try this white light! pity you dont send to WA!!! why is that??? i recieve plants/cactus and herbs weekly from over east, never had a problem!

and i thought it was the buyers risk? i am prepered to take those risks!!!

[Torsten]

bushturkey [love your avatar!] please check the legals forum for details on WA shipping issues.

mooksha -

Do the actives have any effects whilst awake (despite short-lasting nausea)?

-will I be able to maintain my usual everyday activities? or should I organise a few days to spare?

Silene does not have other effects and can be taken while goign about other activities - I believe white light is similar in that respect.

Is a recommended dose of .5g - 1g for morning and night or just morning?

The effect is long term and cumulative, so it doesn't matter what time of day you take it, however only in the morning will your stomach be empty and 'asleep' enough to deal with the emetic effects.

How effective is the froth extraction?

It is the traditional method and by far the most effective.

How long are we meant to shake for? How many 'pulls' or froth extractions are necessary?

I don't think you're entirely getting the concept. Imagine the herb has some soap flakes in it [which is essentially what saponins are]. If you shake with water the soap will dissolve readily and will form a frothy foam. This is the stuff you want as it contains none of the other components of the herb. You don't do multiple pulls and you shake until it frothes.

[Bush Turkey]

bushturkey [love your avatar!] please check the legals forum for details on WA shipping issues.

yeah sorry Torsten.. i found the thread just after i posted

[Thelema]

I would be very suprised to finde anyone on the board other than you coment negativley on my post

maybe that is because no-one else on the board is being attacked by that post other than me.

Long story short if you had a valid argument against my points you wouldn’t have to resolve to name calling would you

Umm what points: do you mean

you seem to have a thorn in your side

or

You seem like a salary man to me

or

I think you need to un pucker you ass checks

or

it pisses you off that others are having fun and your not and you want to pin negative motives on others

They seem pretty close to name calling too, if you don't mind me saying so.

Look, if you want to have a debate about the merits of declaring ingredients in bioactives, then I'm all for it. Let's all have an informed, impassioned debate about the issue. I'm especially interested now in how that topic relates to indigenous concoctions that may not be available to international vendors. This topic has opened my eyes in regard to that. - In that all in all I believe that it is OK to sell such concotions as long as:

1) Effort has been made to ascertain to the best of the chain of knowledge the botanical source

2) That this effort is communicated between vendors.

3) That the prevention of 1&2 is made explicit on the selling or the labelling.

As for the "undeclared": I have gone to great lengths in my life to journey into the unknown, in order to test out new theories or actives and I have found some! What could be better than that! And I have shared that information - and been glad in it...this forum in fact has helped me greatly in my investigations.

Why is that such a bad thing?

You seem particularly intent upon preying upon me.

Please don't speak on Torsten's behalf, either; that's just a disguised general warning. The motive for the warning is that if he disagreed with my evaluation of him, then he could have defended himself.

The role you seem to be taking is that of some strange bandwagoning.

Other than that I can't really seem to grasp your point. For instance, your climactic sentence

Any ethno that the active hasn’t been refined or identified.

doesn't seem to be a sentence at all.

I think it is best that you identify exactly what ideas of mine you disagree with so that we can turn this conversation around into some sort of constructive debate.

[Teljkon]

fghgh

Edited December 19, 2021 by Teljkon

[planthelper]

teljkon, i would like you do offer the peace pipe to thelema.

i can see the point you try to make and i can see thelemas views aswell,

i try to see everything positive and maybe we all (and including you two) could learn a bit here and there out of this confrontation, and work on our characters a bit in a fashion which would mean we are more likely to not have to act as displayed in this thread...

maybe thelema can't see the point you try to make at all and maybe teljkon can't recognize that he is a bit too serious (the posts border a bit towards trolling) in trying to get his point across.

i used the term trolling because i could not find another more loose term,

and want to say that i think teljon is by no means a poster who wants to cause controversy.

anyway, i hope all will go smooth from now on!

[Teljkon]

fdfgdf

Edited December 19, 2021 by Teljkon

[t st tantra]

you talking of silene seeds? just treat like normal seeds,nothing special required.

mine have got quite leggy[long] in the flower stems ,so i think they may have wanted a bit more full sun and less nitrogen once stems were forming.just had my first flower!white flowers are plain but there is something about them i find fascinating.....

t s t .

[hebrew]

they have the most intense perfume silene

[drugo]

thx Torsten

[incognito]

any reports yet?? as this is a legal herb i dont mind posting a factual report.

well this morning (0530) was the first dose of the 'white light' ubuluwu mix sold by sab i administered myself.

instead of the froth method, i had one gram of the white light mixed with a skullable amount of water and downed the lot

ontop of this i also had one gram of the siliene root which i took in the same method.

i have not felt ANY negative effects all day. i will repeat this process every morning until i have used both 7gm vials, and will report back results, if any.

edit- by the way how beautiful does the white light mix smell!!!! would make a lovely parfum hey VS??

just after some input VS or T, drinking the mix as apposed to frothing would give just as good effect if not better?

i mean drinking the mix with some water brings the whole lot of the herb into your stomach?

Edited November 17, 2009 by incognito

[hebrew]

hey incognito

having not tried the white light yet i cant comment, i havent really smelt it i will now though

and i dont see any problems taking it the way you do, that has been how i take silene in the past. traditionally though it was frothed, i guess there is a reason as to why they frothed it. i have had silene both ways and find no difference between the two, i prefer to take it like you did man.

i am interested to hear how you go.

[Rabelais]

t st tantra

you talking of silene seeds? just treat like normal seeds,nothing special required.

mine have got quite leggy[long] in the flower stems ,so i think they may have wanted a bit more full sun and less nitrogen once stems were forming.just had my first flower!white flowers are plain but there is something about them i find fascinating.....

t s t .

t st, Do you have any information on when seeds are likely to be produced? I assume they will not be too far away. I noticed mine are stopping new flower growth in the last weeks or so.

I can empathize with the leggy stems. I had to stake mine a few weeks ago. I love looking at the silene first thing of a morning when the flowers are still open and the subtle scent.

[incognito]

what results did you get from the silene VS?

[t st tantra]

t st, Do you have any information on when seeds are likely to be produced? I assume they will not be too far away. I noticed mine are stopping new flower growth in the last weeks or so.

I can empathize with the leggy stems. I had to stake mine a few weeks ago. I love looking at the silene first thing of a morning when the flowers are still open and the subtle scent.

coincidentally i noticed ripe seed pods earlier today.

the flower stem was brown and at a slightly earlier stage an opening must have formed in the swollen seed pod.

some seed had fallen out but most? were still there.

planted new seeds today....should have seed to spare soon.....

t s t .