Hybrid legality

[Rev]

Edited October 19, 2007 by Rev

[Jesus On Peyote]

Interesting.

I would think as soon as they are known, then if whatever hybrid,produced anything thats illegal then it would be quickly scedualed like the analogues act for Rcs.?

[Rev]

its a possibility but it would have to be documented

i know about PBR legislation documentation requiremnets and it cost big bucks for each lodgement

i would think the problem of botanical ID esp with non flowering hybrid material would certainly give the defence the upper hand on burden of proof

and make prosecution less likely unless extraction was evident

[Jesus On Peyote]

Tru, also a level of secrecy like the manhatton project would help too.

They cant get hat cnt be found or dont exist.

[Torsten]

a similar scenario would be genetically engineered species, where a desirable gene from an illegal plant is put into a legal plant. No botanist could call the result by the single gene source species and hence the new plant would be legal.

Not sure how it would go with 50/50 crosses though. Certainly, if you managed to breed an individual or stable variety from a hybrid, and this new plant had most characteristics of the legal plant then I can't se how it could be illegal.

This idea has been around about salvia for quite a few years.

[Jesus On Peyote]

hmm,Gen engineering would probably be easier\quicker too, if you had the knowledge and equipment.

[Greeny]

What about hybriding a load of illegal ones like MJ and Cocaine

I CALL IT COCANNABIS

Its worth a try I guess however

[Jesus On Peyote]

Getting fat budds with cocain instead of thc.. at 20% thc/coca ratio

[Vertmorpheus]

PBR is a bastard of a thing to get your head around and a highly unfair system in some ways... cashed up massive breeding mobs just find a freak and throw money around til its "theirs" but joe nursery , patiently breeding something over a couple dozen gens, never gets a look in. then there's the issue of biopiracy, ie ppl going to developing nations, pinching plants and bringing them back as something "they" came up with. Also unfair is that selling PBR material is really only a no no IF it can be shown you should've known better...crazy shit.

You could do all kinds of crazy things to plants, illegal or not... but the fact is , if you DID breed a super sally x coca x canna x kiwifruit, you'd be bragging, sharing around, whatnot... eventually it'd be found growing alongside someones hydro setup, or their poppy crop, and the coppers would get nosey as to why you have three kilos of kiwifruit soaking in solvent in the bathroom. As fast as people find "good plants" the bad people ban em, regulate em, fuck with us.

Then there's the issue that the gov cares more about quantities of actives than sources or forms... and if you put say thc into watermelons (niiiice thought :d ) well guess what, once they suss whats what you're going to be done for the whole weight of the plant, the vine the fruit the lot. Wet. Untrimmed.Nasty!I've grown 15kg watermelons and they get bigger than that

On the other hand, if you can source (and pay for) expert testimony to the effect that you actually had species x not species y, you might have a chance. Maybe. But the breeding process etc involved would have to fill your house with illegal shit anyway, then byproducts of testing xtraction bla bla.

Nice idea, but overall might be better off just sticking to the classics, nature does tend to know best. As if the neighbours or visiting coppers would ID a coca patch among the weeds down the back, or the odd poppy here n there in a bed full of annuals and other kinds of poppy.It's a matter of context. If you only have 10 plants in your entire yard or house and none of em look familiar at all, except in worrying ways, then you havea problem. But if you have greenlife left right n centre, noone looks twice at most of it.But I'm guessing someone wanting to grow hybrid sally would also have a mushie chamber going, some buds growing, whatever else...plus a PC fulla drug info and sites like this

Once the PTB sussed what it was, and that'd happen fairly quickly I reckon, it'd get put on some list like most fun things in life.Just the way it is.

GD

[occidentalis]

Once the PTB sussed what it was, and that'd happen fairly quickly I reckon, it'd get put on some list like most fun things in life.Just the way it is.

The TGA only meets (how often - twice a year?) not very often. So by the time they've figured out what you're doing, written a report, consulted the consultants, read the report, discussed it, advertised the fact they'll be deciding on it, decided on it, published it... etc.... you'll already have cleaned your house of all those illegal salvia/coleus hybrids and be on to the salvia/mentha hybrids. They make a nice cool drink as well.

[Torsten]

the TGA meets 4 times a year. They can have stuff scheduled in 3 months if they want to, but usually 6.

The attorney general of each state and of the commonwelth can have things emergency scheduled within a day.

[Auxin]

In the US the only Lophophora that is illegal is williamsii (keep in mind the genus was collapsed making fricii and some others into williamsii) technically a F1 hybrid might be borderline criminal but if it does not retain sufficient characteristics to fit the official botanical definition of L. williamsii then it should be perfectly legal, even if its 10% mescaline.

[teonanacatl]

mexicali got some loph x astros into aus, he said no probs with customs cos its a hybrid

[occidentalis]

mexicali got some loph x astros into aus, he said no probs with customs cos its a hybrid

But lophs aren't illegal in Australia.

[shruman]

Arent they illegal to import?

[Vertmorpheus]

That's it, australia is VERY good when it comes to knowing just what to ban... eg harmaline rather than watttles... other countries can get away with these legal shifty things, here in ozland, it's kept simple. If the coppers don't like the look of it, the courts won't either, and they can get expert testimony to back up just about anything they feel they have to. I used to work under a traineeship as a lab assistant at the John Tonge Centre in brissie - high level spookiness, forensic path n biol, tox, even a v4 virology area (love that idea...sittin down for smoko next to a room full of ebola). Half the case workers I knew (who incidentally were a lot less attractive than those CSI people) spent every other week off proving this or that on johnnies behalf. Woo... and the bloke runnin the place old Leo Freney is a member of tattersalls...and a decent whack of those blokes are masons.... CONSPIRACY!!!

[shruman]

lucky u can still grow ayahuasca (harmaline), and using wattles or ayahuasca are illegal.

And at the moment there are only 5 plants banned in oz (5 to many) but they could ban a lot more.

[Vertmorpheus]

are or arent illegal? Can't remember being booked for having wattles recently. BUmmer is, if they get that motivated to come and getcha, it comes down to active weights. Heroin soaked lucerne is still illegal despite it not being "papaver". Its a matter of how bad they want to do you when alls said n done. Noone I've heard of has ever gotten their way with the "no its indica not sativa" routine eh?

Nice thought as I said, rather see nutritive or healing traits put into weedy tough plants though, might be a lil more helpful to the planet than tomacco

[teonanacatl]

One of the organic chem lecturers here was invited to a forensic meeting a while back, it was mentioned that they were coming across more mescaline being used, but not in pure form, people were eating 'this cactus' to get high. Dont know whether it was a local meeting or what.

There was a big bust in UK for cactus awhile back, was a member of the nook. He said he got a tip off so had gotten rid of most stuff but when they busted in they were expecting to find a big lab type setup making synthetics. They didnt even know what to charge him with and let him go so they could do some research on the matter.

Whilst the cops seem more interested atm with meth and the likes if they wished they could make life very hard if they wanted to. Imagine a cop stumbles upon here, they wont believe the foaf or friend in another country crap, give them awhile and im sure they would have enough evidence to knock on the door of most people here.

Edited April 21, 2007 by teonanacatl

[Jesus On Peyote]

The attorney general of each state and of the commonwelth can have things emergency scheduled within a day.

That doesent sound very democratic :/

How do they get to ban shit when the majority of the population doesent even know what it is. bastards

[Rev]

Edited October 19, 2007 by Rev

[Torsten]

There was a big bust in UK for cactus awhile back, was a member of the nook.

He just got off. Judge threw out the case. sorry, can't find the ref, but was only a week or two ago.

[teonanacatl]

Yeah they didnt have much of a case granted every headshop in UK sells the stuff.

[Guest Øskorei]

the TGA meets 4 times a year. They can have stuff scheduled in 3 months if they want to, but usually 6.

The attorney general of each state and of the commonwelth can have things emergency scheduled within a day.

What would justify an emergency schedule, and are there any precedents that might be shared with the forum?

[Jesus On Peyote]

Maybe like salvia?

A bunch of websites came up starting to sell it claiming to be the new thing. probebly if they knew too much but it would be hard for em. i hope