62 replies to this topic

[ENtiTY]

A question about the pasturisation steps.

Is there any reason you can't use an oven on its lowest setting to do the same thing? Would be a bit simpler.

I was thinking in the oven at 90C for 3 hours then turn off oven and let cool. Wouldn't this do the same job?

[Hyphal]

I was thinking in the oven at 90C for 3 hours then turn off oven and let cool. Wouldn't this do the same job?

No because 90°C isn't 80°C.... If however you can keep your oven at a steady temp of between 72°C and 80°C then yes, you could use your oven no worries at all.

I just find it requires too much fine tuning and monitoring to get these temps steady - easier to just heat up some water to the desired temp, and pour it into an insulated chamber to keep it at that temp (esky).

[Ace]

Hyphas tek sounds like the way to go, but if you were forced to use an oven, you could hold it open slightly to keep temps slightly lower

[Therefore]

oh yeah.
Just been cruising an inner city park with horse riding school near by. Got me some nice manure all aged and ready for a bulk tek.

will let you know how i go.....feeling good about this.

[Μορφέας]

great write up Hyphalknot, brilliant
iv saved this webpage permanantly now haha

[Hyphal]

Thanks Narcissism!

Good luck greencoat - let us know how it goes...

[Therefore]

well so far so good.

Probably one week to go b4 my bulk substrate is colonized fully.
It has taken a bit of time to colonize for a couple of reasons i think.
a.) i don't think my spawn to bulk substart ratio was high enough. Should have used less bulk substrate for the amount of spawn i had.
b.) needs to be a bit warmer to aid colonization....might move my box to a warmer position tonight. (near the clothes dryer)

just a few questions though.....

Why must the bulk substrate fully colonize before adding a casing layer? Wouldn't there be enough water in the bulk substrate to act as a casing layer already?

After you have mixed the spawn into the Bulk substrate could you add the casing layer here and then wait for the myc to pop through.


I assume the reason to let the BS fully colonize is that it will aid more even pinning later...? Is this correct


I have a thin layer of coco coir already on top......could i just fruit from this once the myc pokes through?



well anyway i will just follow the tek as written at this stage but was just wondering these questions. I know a few other are trying this tek as we speak......and a few popcorners too.\


good luck..



PS

found this bulk neglect tek from mycofile at the Shroomery to be very good for ideas/concepts

http://www.shroomery...-Neglect-Report

Edited by .:. Greencavefloat .:., 19 May 2007 - 05:23 PM.

[Hyphal]

Why must the bulk substrate fully colonize before adding a casing layer? Wouldn't there be enough water in the bulk substrate to act as a casing layer already?

Your substrate must colonise fully to avoid contamination - if you have areas that are uncolonised, they are wide open to other spores/bacteria to thrive on, and for obvious reasons this isnt good.

Now I see what your saying about a casing layer - you can fruit without one, but you then need to make sure your growing parameters are optimal - eg. you need 100% humidity etc. A casing layer provides optimal growing conditions, helps protect the substrate from contams, and acts like a big sponge in which the fruits can draw more moisture from (mushrooms are 90% water).

Think of it as like a big, wet blanket for your substrate.

After you have mixed the spawn into the Bulk substrate could you add the casing layer here and then wait for the myc to pop through.

After your substrate is colonised, add your casing layer and then continue to incubate for another 2 or 3 days in the dark - when you see one or two spots of mycelium popping through, its ready to be exposed to fruiting conditions.

I assume the reason to let the BS fully colonize is that it will aid more even pinning later...? Is this correct

Its very bad to have areas that are left uncolonised, and yeah in a way I suppose you could say it will aid a more even pinset - but thats not the reason to let it fully colonise.

I have a thin layer of coco coir already on top......could i just fruit from this once the myc pokes through?

Im not sure why you have already added a thin layer of coir to the top - you shouldnt have done that until the susbtrate had colonised. But yes, in a way, that sounds like a casing.

Thanks for that link on the shroomery - it is a good example of why a casing layer is important. Mycofile wouldn't have had the same result without one. Heck, you can even fruit a substrate in the open air if you have a nice thick casing layer and you keep it moist.

Good luck!

[Therefore]

Yes added a thin layer of coir before it was time. Reasons being to protect exposed straw from contam. Similar to what mycofile did with the extra straw-free dung that he layed on top (mixed with some spawn). But perhaps my way has in fact put my edibles in danger. Well as i say it is very thin so i figured it should be safe. Anyway so far so good. Will be a success i am sure.... Thanks again dude.

[Therefore]

Had some left over bulk substrate that i didnt use. Put it in the freezer and will re pasteur when other jars are fully done. My girlfriend was a bit pissed when she found out what was in those heavily wrapped bags....oh dear. Not sure what the freezer will do to it but.......what the hey its worth the loss of one jar.

[Therefore]

ah.....1st flush looking good. Pics to come.
Much larger 1st flush than cased grain.....horse crap is worth it's weight in gold.


Although as these are Orissa strain.....the fun comes after the 1st flush. Very large 2nd flush expected.

Thanks hyph

[ENtiTY]

Pics GCF PICS!!

[Hyphal]

ah.....1st flush looking good. Pics to come.
Much larger 1st flush than cased grain.....horse crap is worth it's weight in gold.
Although as these are Orissa strain.....the fun comes after the 1st flush. Very large 2nd flush expected.

Thanks hyph

Just glad it helped someone!

[Genesis]

Did this ever get turned into a PDF file? If you want to clean it up and add more info I would love to convert it. Also I was thinking maybe one of us should host a geocities site as an archive.

Thanks for this amazing post. I learnt alot.

Gen

[MindExpansion]

This is a bulk substrate question that just popped into my head and I thought here would be the place to ask.
Could you add water crystals to a bulk substrate before spawning? Since hydration seems so important to the effectiveness of the bulk, I thought that this might be a good way to supply more water.
Any thoughts from the more experienced guys or anyone else?
Peace

[watertrade]

This is a bulk substrate question that just popped into my head and I thought here would be the place to ask.
Could you add water crystals to a bulk substrate before spawning? Since hydration seems so important to the effectiveness of the bulk, I thought that this might be a good way to supply more water.
Any thoughts from the more experienced guys or anyone else?
Peace

I was wondering about this too - never tried it though. Maybe a little bit would help as long you don't add too much and make it mushy or create an anaerobic environment. Also it would shrink more than any other moisture absorbing addition compared to vermiculite for example. It’s my gut feeling that it could work but it might just be easier to use something like vermiculite or similar. Less messy etc.

I encourage you to give it a go! and report back with results

I think if I was doing it I would add a tiny bit of something nutritious to encourage mycelium growth in the gel and maybe a bit of H2O2 as well.

[Chiral]

You would have to make sure the crystals are very evenly distributed through the substrate...NOT EASY...but certainly doable...crystals have tendency to clump when wet if not distributed evenly...but hey give it a go on a trial batch. If using wild bird seed when washing and straining the seed prior to pasteurising is probably the time to put the crystals in..so you will be able to see how they act when they become wet within the seed. They expend quite a lot to so that will be something to think about.

Be cool if it works and assists with watering...

H.

[MindExpansion]

Ok, hopefully i can get a quick response for this, is the coir really necessary?
Don't ask why lol but can you just use horse poo with straw?
Peace

[JDanger]

I'd guess so, but the coir would probably help.

Then again, I'm no expert. At all.

[Chiral]

coir to help with water retention..that shit rocks for everything.

H.

[MindExpansion]

Horse shit retains lots of moisture on its own, and so does straw, apparently horse shit can be used on its own.
But I want to know how much difference it makes.
Peace

[Hyphal]

It just helps add bulk easily - the more substrate you have, the more fruits you get. But of course, if you have access to bulk horse poo (which can be used on its own no worries) then go for it. It can just be a pain to collect lots and break it up to the righ consistency, so adding some coir give more substrate easily and hassle free.

[WoodDragon]

We have a Clydsedale, and consequently I have a few barrow-loads of poo each week. To date I'd been using a chipper to turn it into a delicious fluff for the vegie garden, but the call of the Portebello is beckoning, as the Aussie winter comes and with it the hankering for mushroom soup.

So, how might I pasteurise a few barrowloads at once? I actually have about three trailer-loads piled up at the moment, so I could really go to town. The trouble is, with the kitchen off-limits (how unreasonable is that?!) I'd have to do it all outside.

Anyone every tried to rig up a 44-gal drum steamer? Would solarising in black plastic bags cut the mustard? If I can find some of my old ibuttons I'll have a bash at testing the solarisation approach, but any experience from peeps here would be muchly appreciated.

[Chiral]

A friend of mine has had some decent results using the cow manure $5 sold in Bunnings...pasturised with sugar cane mulch $8...also available from Bunnings...and you have your self a very large amount of substrate that can be used for months and months....just thought I'd add this as it's not always easy for people to hunt down straw and poo.

They have told me though that just straight straw packed down hard with spawn and left to colonise for 3 days then fruit without casing can give excellent results...casing is not necessary really....having said that they are going to try and do a straight straw substrate and then case lightly with poo...as in nature the fruits will pop up through the poo...but it's not necessary to case at all.

H.

Edited by Hunab Ku, 28 April 2009 - 07:26 AM.

[watertrade]

We have a Clydsedale, and consequently I have a few barrow-loads of poo each week. To date I'd been using a chipper to turn it into a delicious fluff for the vegie garden, but the call of the Portebello is beckoning, as the Aussie winter comes and with it the hankering for mushroom soup.

So, how might I pasteurise a few barrowloads at once? I actually have about three trailer-loads piled up at the moment, so I could really go to town. The trouble is, with the kitchen off-limits (how unreasonable is that?!) I'd have to do it all outside.

Anyone every tried to rig up a 44-gal drum steamer? Would solarising in black plastic bags cut the mustard? If I can find some of my old ibuttons I'll have a bash at testing the solarisation approach, but any experience from peeps here would be muchly appreciated.

Hi wooddragon,
I'm having some success with fermenting bulk substrates. I just need to finish writing it up. but basically you chuck it in a large vessel add water and wait - the whole mess ferments ( and really stinks) but once its done after a week or so you empty it out, let it dry for a bit then spawn. I will hopefully get it written up properly next week. But using a 44 gal drum is the way to go - and an able bodied mate to help lift it out ;)