:huh:

[Rev]

Edited April 21, 2007 by Rev

[gomaos]

according to this, it is illegal to sell the spores?

[deaders]

Illegal to sell spores with the intent to cultivate mushrooms from them. It wouldnt have been hard to establish that with PF as he was selling books on how to cultivate mushrooms and actually growing them in his own house at the same time.

[Torsten]

"The website also provided a first-person description of the mental disorientation and physical sickness that results from eating hallucinogenic mushrooms."

Laughing my ass off !!!

But that's about the only funny part of this story.

[Thelema]

this case says nothing about the illegality of distributing or selling of spores. Both were charged with possession of psilocybin/psilocin. Since spores have neither, they have not addressed that issue. Even tho mcpherson admitted that he intended to procure an illegal substance using the spores, this is not in itself any legal argument that spores are illegal to possess.

I was going to write a reply in the current myc section about this, but here goes:

Spores in themselves are not illegal in australia, nor are they illegal to import. As far as I know, no-one has ever been charged with importation or possession of spores in Oz.

We must distinguish the legality of the spores from the seperate argument: intention to create psilocybin. Spores COULD be used as evidence in a court to show intent to manufacture psilocybin, the charge would fall under ATTEMPTs under criminal sanction.

But it is a far cry from saying that something COULD be used as evidence in a case to saying that it itself is illegal.

Of course, there's nothing to stop a judge laying down some precedent declaring that possession of spores automatically creates a presumption of intention to manufacture an illegal substance. But this hasnt happened yet.

It is also unlikely that spores will or could be banned by a national body such as the NDPSC, for spores are neither drugs nor poisons. If spores are banned, it will have to be on a state level.

That's all for now, input appreciated.

[ 25. August 2003, 13:57: Message edited by: Thelema ]

[Torsten]

Originally posted by Thelema:

Spores in themselves are not illegal in australia

True.

nor are they illegal to import. As far as I know, no-one has ever been charged with importation or possession of spores in Oz.

Wrong on two counts.

You are right in that importing spores does not contravene customs laws, however it does contravene quarantine laws. You are also wrong about no one having been prosecuted over importing spores. In one case customs actually tried to prosecute, but gave up and left it to Aqis. They pushed hard for the maximum and got it. $2000 fine (which was the maximum at the time), and 2 years good behaviour bond.

In the other case customs did not get involved, but quarantine still pursued the maximum penalty (which is unusual for first time offences like this). Again it was a $2000 fine with no additional condition.

The interesting thing was that BOTH matters were taken to court even though both defendants pleaded guilty and offered to pay the maximum. Obviously customs/quarantine thought they could somehow make a greater impact this way.

Until a couple of years ago it was no big drama to take the risk on $2000. However these days the maximum is no longer $2000, but somethign like $55,000 (and rising). not a laughing matter anymore!!

Spores COULD be used as evidence in a court to show intent to manufacture psilocybin, the charge would fall under ATTEMPTs under criminal sanction.

While attempts (ie "conspiracy to manufacture") is a lot more difficult to prove than when they catch you in the act, it does nonetheless offer the same penalties as the actual act. Many folks don't realise this.

Spores would be very successful in prosecution if there was also cultivation literature in the possession of that person.

But it is a far cry from saying that something COULD be used as evidence in a case to saying that it itself is illegal.

Yes, impotant point!!

It is also unlikely that spores will or could be banned by a national body such as the NDPSC, for spores are neither drugs nor poisons. If spores are banned, it will have to be on a state level.

A little simplistic. Years ago it was inconceivable that the TGA would make laws that dictate drug schedules to the states and yet we already have several such instances. The TGA is taking over as the federal government tries to 'harmonise' the legislation in the australian states and NZ.

While the TGA is unlikely to prohibit spores, it would be quite easy for customs to ban their import. In fact, they already can confiscate them under the community protection laws which alloow them to refuse entry to any item that can be used in the manufacture of drugs (eg ephedra seeds, which can be grown into ephedra plants which contain ephedrine etc).

The TGA has already schduled many substances that can be used to manufacture drugs, so I see no reason why they can't schedule Psilocybe spores.

And the states can easily broaden their conspiracy laws to include spores. They don't need to apply logic.

make the most of your freedom while you can folks.....