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Rock.0

A couple of Acacia IDs

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Hi there,

I've long been on the hunt for alkaloid producing acacias in my area (SE Melbourne), particularly something that could be sustainably harvested, i.e. from phyllodes.

So I've got a few samples I'd love IDs on please :)

 

(sorry for pic orientation - not sure how to correct this)

Sample 1: 19/06/2020 - I think this is a Floribunda but would love confirmation.

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Sample 2: 21/06/2020 - Pretty sure this is also Floribunda

20200621_084924.thumb.jpg.5ccb8ecbf4d14d12b9abd1813f775623.jpg20200621_095700.thumb.jpg.6840f97b7aa2339e4455ce3eb78501d4.jpg20200621_095721.thumb.jpg.d99055564de38635f7806cb30e9b6248.jpg20200621_095751.thumb.jpg.fad33cd4ff5876e4caa6209e07fc50ff.jpg

 

Sample 3: 21/06/2020 - This one looks quite different, note the quite pronounced reddish colour of the stems

20200621_085142.thumb.jpg.2d7f5e9ad47eec16877801345c5d6f52.jpg20200621_085152.thumb.jpg.050dcd064dc5d6e9e90802550f64fcc0.jpg20200621_085205.thumb.jpg.a95d4acbd940605aa8169765298ff3b1.jpg20200621_095837.thumb.jpg.637c0a13ceca11ddbad018bccb1dfc29.jpg20200621_095924.thumb.jpg.a1387a596a876b0e8fd7bcdb9553c774.jpg20200621_095959.thumb.jpg.9b29218a2090d454fe7b6479d9ba7515.jpg20200621_100032.thumb.jpg.68c265208bd0e5c1fdf249d683bb2aab.jpg20200621_100113.thumb.jpg.4ee18c5688c93fd21ddf70538714eed2.jpg

 

Sample 4: 21/06/2020 - Also quite different, the branches seemed to be quite elongated and droop down towards the ground; phyllodes protrude perpendicular to the stem

20200621_085531.thumb.jpg.5f30c23f06c90dcfbe1141f9148714e2.jpg20200621_100148.thumb.jpg.67d622f6a4acb183b7aba7917affb750.jpg20200621_100215.thumb.jpg.de2febff85f303792cdb52ef63707a79.jpg20200621_100230.thumb.jpg.6bfaa4837d3fe7b80d0aa3837544b49f.jpg

 

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Hi Rock.0, 

While removing phyllodes is generally less harmful than bark stripping, searching for plant material that has been removed from Acacias without your intervention would be a more sustainable harvesting technique than removing living plant material from the trees yourself, as you seem to have done in these photos. 

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I leave the id'ing to the acacia specialist, but one thing I can tell you for certain.

acacias come general in two flower types, cylindrical and spherical, and so far without exception,

all alkaloid acacias where displaying cylindrical flowers.

 

don't waste your time on spherical flowers as you posted pics of.

this trick, I was told by torsten!:P

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1 hour ago, Wile E. Peyote said:

Hi Rock.0, 

While removing phyllodes is generally less harmful than bark stripping, searching for plant material that has been removed from Acacias without your intervention would be a more sustainable harvesting technique than removing living plant material from the trees yourself, as you seem to have done in these photos. 

Thank you for the reminder, it's been a long whie since I've been searching for acacias, I just didn't think.

And to be completely clear, I am not planning on harvesting from wild trees, I may however take cuttings for propagation, but I'm hoping to learn more about IDing as I go.

 

 

54 minutes ago, withdrawl clinic said:

I leave the id'ing to the acacia specialist, but one thing I can tell you for certain.

acacias come general in two flower types, cylindrical and spherical, and so far without exception,

all alkaloid acacias where displaying cylindrical flowers.

 

don't waste your time on spherical flowers as you posted pics of.

this trick, I was told by torsten!:P

Mate that is very useful to know, thanks for passing that on. Such a quick and easy thing to look for.

Acacia Floribunda definitely has cylindrical flowering patterns (spikes), which are present on Sample 1 and 2.

I have also heard that supposedly there are different floribunda varieties, some of which yield DMT, some do not.

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22 hours ago, Rock.0 said:

 I may however take cuttings for propagation

 

 

 

I am pretty sure, that acacia cuttings are close to impossible to produce, so forget that...

maybe some super cool tissue culture specialist managed, but it's not for us.

 

and why do you start, by random sorting trees, research what others have found out first.

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1 hour ago, withdrawl clinic said:

I am pretty sure, that acacia cuttings are close to impossible to produce, so forget that...

maybe some super cool tissue culture specialist managed, but it's not for us.

 

and why do you start, by random sorting trees, research what others have found out first.

Thanks for letting me know! I just assumed it wouldn't be that difficult, so you've saved me a lot of time, and of course, removing plant material in the future.

Still curious about the IDs of those acacias so I can better familiarise myself with them.

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You seem to have the right attitude Rock.0, but I want to make it really clear for anyone reading this that removing living material (and surely in some cases, non-living material) from vulnerable species should be avoided, even if your intent is to propagate. If you don't know what the species is, there is a chance that it is vulnerable. Acacia courtii is a prime example of a vulnerable species.

I do hope people experiment with courtii cuttings, but only from their own cultivated plants. I know of three people that have had success rooting Acacia courtii cuttings. As lots of people have young courtii plants that have not yet set seed, and because wild harvesting courtii cuttings and even seed for propagation poses unnecessary risk to this vulnerable species, this cutting technique is an important conservation opportunity.

 

Communacacian describes the method he and Ferret developed;

The bottom 2/3 of foliage was removed and remaining phyllodes were cut in half to reduce moisture loss and stress. I started with around 30 cuttings from varying specimens from young tube stock to mature trees. I used a variety of rooting hormones from powder to gels of various strengths all of which contain IBA (Indole-3-butyric acid), dipping the cuttings in the mixture for 30-60 seconds. I even bought some pure IBA powder and mixed it up with acetone to create my own rooting liquids.

Cutting medium:
60% coco coir, 40% perlite

Starting in spring the cuttings were placed on a heat mat and watered daily with irrigation in a greenhouse scenario. No striking for months so I eventually turned off the heat mat and somewhat forgot about them. Over the next 8-9 months the cutting happily stayed alive without striking, at this point I basically gave up and the tags outlining the method used on each cutting were removed and reused elsewhere. A few weeks ago my irrigation started to play up and everything dried out a few times until irrigation was fixed. Yesterday, cleaning up the greenhouse I went to remove them and noticed some root action just before throwing it out!

So in a nut shell the cuttings did nothing for 11-12 months then a few rooted suddenly. I suspect this it do to the increase in seasonal temperature and possibly due to them drying out sporadically, something ferret had mentioned had happened too before rooting. I think that under irrigation the cutting can take up enough water to survive without rooting and that the temporary drying out forced them into producing roots in search of moisture! How to replicate this without them totally drying out will be tricky but I’m sure it can be done! The other thing to note is that In the last month or so I had moved the cutting from the bench onto the ground, perhaps having them closer to earth has played some part it rooting too. I washed the medium away from one that rooted and it can be seen that the roots emerged from a node, which is to be expected so if you want to try this make sure you have a node at the bottom.”
 

My other friend described his technique more simply “semi hardwood cuttings put into a greenhouse with misting and humidity control.” He claimed a 30% strike rate with this technique.

Edited by Wile E. Peyote
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