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Xperiment

MAOI/SSRI interaction advice please

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Hi, 

I'm relatively new to this but I've read enough to know that it's a bad idea to mix plants containing MAOIs with the SSRIs that I'm currently on. Sertraline (Zoloft) 100mg daily for anxiety,  depression and PTSD. I've been taking it for almost 18 months.  In the long term I want to get off  Zoloft. I recently tried (doctors idea) to reduce my dosage but that didn't end well. 

I have trouble sleeping,  getting to sleep. 

I don't feel like myself at all. I can feel the medication not allowing me to feel as down or depressed,  but more so I can feel it dulling any happiness I experience. 

My question relates to plant helpers. Which medicines can be safely taken with SSRI medication,  that would aid in treating depression and anxiety?

  I am open to pretty much anything,  but prefer something that I could grow at home here on the Mid North Coast NSW? 

Thanks in advance for your help. 

 

 

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Hi @Xperiment

I've written a few posts on things that have helped me. Some I explored on antidepressants before I stopped using them. The thing is you need to be careful of not just excess serotonergic stimulation but other interactions, for example if your pharmaceutical is by chance a CYP2A6 inhibitor (sertraline inhibits this, whether to clinical relevance I'm not sure), you might not want to use, or be extra cautious with oregano oil (quite an effective antidepressant IMO). We don't know a lot about drug-plant interactions...

I'd personally maybe try a low dose augmentation with saffron. This has been studied as an augmentation strategy for SSRI induced sexual dysfunction and seems safe and effective.

But for me, diet shifts were more powerful, getting back to cacao and spirulina for breakfast etc...blueberries, high polyphenol intake of wide variety but my situation was complicated.

Best wishes.

Edited by Alchemica
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I didn't think anything could be mixed with ssri's except for cannabinoids so left them well behind years ago in their significance and found looking back they just made me simply not care about anything ... and nowadays couldn't even take em if I wanted to ..

... if it's any consolation I don't sleep either until the wheels fall off so to speak so *sends hugs*

 

I recently learned that skeletum tortuosum was a mild plant ssri and that was worth visiting I thought a few months ago .. felt like a bit of a potential for addiction so left it but I think it was a 1:100 extract.. but that's kinda my view to find something to replace a pharma med and wouldn't use both at the same time or anything and I gather it takes a while for SSRI's to leave the body by the way my drs were like "it dsn matter if you miss a dose or 4 or 7 or 13" ... lol 

 

instead of ceiling gazing waiting for the sleep function to kick in after a couple o' decades of getting bored of it I figured I'd use the time to study and catch up where I needed in life ... 

 

Diet shifts are indeed powerful .. It was an easier time trying to get sleep and often successful for almost a year by deducting as many processed sugars from my diet as possible 

(headache diet) but in that my dr also agreed to have no ssri's in me, finally; to experiment with triptans ...and me to experiment with the like.... and life seems much better since, regardless of never fixing the sleep problem..

 

now with my prerogative to augment my exterior with my interior in respects to gender, I am using these sugars again gradually ( I'm of the beleif that what I have to keep headaches at bay will still work even with sugars) so end of experiment can conclude at least for me that processed sugars = less sleep but hopefully not invoke hemiplegic migraine n paralasys ... which is a big risk for us non-sleepneeder types I learned the hard way with.. that's if you're not a sleepneeder like most ... for all I know you might be so if so please disregard at will..

 

but yeah would really love to be able to help more than I did but figured Id show why I can't any deeper tho too

...and wishing you a safe passage through to a happier day - i mean night .. lol day and night is my day .. sometimes several in a row :3..  ultimately though to a happier sleep and recharge for ya.

 

I know there's some promising ptsd tratments utilizing low dosage combined with therapy simultaneously in the pipeline coming from MAPS san antonio CA in USA tho .. 

 

Edited by ☽Ţ ҉ĥϋηϠ₡яღ☯ॐ€ðяئॐ♡Pϟiℓℴϟℴ
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Yeah CBD is another good antidepressant/anxiolytic option, it is however a potent inhibitor of human CYP3A enzymes, this is relevant for example in a clinical trial that found that 25mg of orally administered CBD significantly blocked the metabolism of an anti-epileptic drug. That shouldn't be relevant to sertraline use IMO but *consult a professional for more questions on safety*

I'd suggest things like Gardenia jasminoides to grow, that has rapid acting antidepressant activity and is a beautiful plant with TCM applications.

Edit: Sceletium or even Aptenia (mild but it grows quickly) is worth growing as an antidepressant succulent. Kanna is apparently sometimes used cautiously to augment SSRIs in Africa. It's not something I suggest though.

Edited by Alchemica
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Thank you for your helpful replies. 

 

@Alchemica I have read through many of your posts on here and while some of the technical aspects fly way above my head,  I get the gist of it. I appreciate the time and energy that you put into it.

 

I will read some more on saffron and dietary changes and give it a try, as well as the Gardenia and Aptenia. 

I have tried pot and lemongrass (for myrcene) separately. Pot didn't seem to affect me the way it used to when I was younger,  didn't do a great deal at all but then I only used a small amount.

The tiny amount of lemongrass I smoked make me feel so tired and heavy that I laid on the floor for almost 2 hours with no energy to move.  As my energy slowly returned, with it came a splitting headache that lasted several days. So I thought no more experimenting without further advice. 

 

@☽Ţ ҉ĥϋηϠ₡яღ☯ॐ€ðяئॐ♡Pϟiℓℴϟℴ

 

On sertraline I do feel as though I don't care about anything,  if not completely then at least nowhere near how I used to. I feel like I'm going through the motions a lot of the time in a world that doesn't make sense. I think I appear outwardly "normal" (maybe a bit eccentric), not that I really care how I appear, but for someone like me with a full time job and a bunch of kids,  I think I don't seem as crazy as I feel sometimes but often I "come to" with no solid recollection of what I'm doing or how I got here.

The sleep thing is a problem for me because I need to get up at 5am for work. Ideally I would like to go to sleep at 930 ish, but often it's not til after midnight that I drop off.  I don't function very well on less sleep.  

Regarding sugars,  I really need to take them out of my diet. I've always had a sweet tooth but now I feel like my sense of taste and smell is disappearing too,  I like to scoff down a dessert after dinner for some sensory pleasure :-)

 

Thank you both for your responses,  I now have some ideas where to start. 

 

 

Edited by Xperiment
Typos & auto correct fails
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Hey @Xperiment

 

Any particular plants you were interested in using? I haven't had any noticeable interactions ingesting san pedro brew, salvia or NN-DMT (on its own) and being on a hefty dose of tricyclic antidepressants, not an SSRI but comparable contradictions.

 

I've foolishly pushed the boundaries in the past smoking changa w MAOIs while on said medication which I found out can be really dangerous :slap: Definitely would not recommend anything with Syrian rue or Caapi in it.

 

Used to be on Zoloft years ago, had exact same effects as you described, makes you like a zombie...cant feel good or bad :wacko:

Edited by Martyh64
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Hi @Martyh64,

I first started along this path,  already being a bit of a gardener,  and reading about Terence McKenna. That lead from mushrooms to Ayahuasca and on and on. So those would be on my "one day" list. One day being when I'm off the meds. Pretty keen on salvia one day too. 

 

One thing about my anxiety is that it makes me overly cautious,  until one day I have a blinding flash of confidence and decide to challenge myself and do something outrageous,  so I thought I'd forearm myself with some knowledge first in case that day comes soon and I can make a smart decision. 

 

I like the idea of growing my own plants,  so some of what I have growing might give you an idea of my interest:

T. Pachanoi seedlings

Wild dagga

Mugwort

Calea zacatechichi

Hops

Passiflora

 

Mild to wild I know, but some relate to my other interests (or former interests, like brewing) and others I started to help with sleep. 

Anyway I am open to any ideas I am just fascinated by plants and enjoy growing them for their own sake. 

Thanks for your reply Martyh64

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