Psychedelics not linked to mental health problems or suicidal behavior: A population study

[Evil Genius]

Psychedelics not linked to mental health problems or suicidal behavior: A population study

http://jop.sagepub.com/content/early/2015/02/25/0269881114568039.full

[Paradoxical]

Also in that same edition is:

Classic psychedelic use is associated with reduced psychological distress and suicidality in the United States adult population

(From another independent lab)

and

Psilocybin-assisted treatment for alcohol dependence: A proof-of-concept study

(From Rick Strassman's lab)

[Paradoxical]

and

Peak experiences and the afterglow phenomenon: When and how do therapeutic effects of hallucinogens depend on psychedelic experiences?

[Change]

I wish things were black and white but unfortunately the grey areas in life make definitive statements and certainty of anything hard to come by

I wish it was as simple as this compound is healing and this compound is toxic but things aren't that simple

here is an abstract from a journal that i cant access

[Suicide under the influence of "magic mushrooms"]. Abstract

Psilocybin/psilocin from so-called psychoactive mushrooms causes hallucinogenic effects. Especially for people with mental or psychiatric disorders ingestion of magic mushrooms may result in horror trips combined with the intention of self-destruction and suicidal thoughts. Automutilation after consumption of hallucinogenic mushrooms has already been described. Our case report demonstrates the suicide of a man by self-inflicted cut and stab injuries. A causal connection between suicidal behaviour and previous ingestion of psychoactive mushrooms is discussed.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23878898

Im not trying to say Psychedelics are bad, im just trying to point out the other side of the situation.

I know i probably upset a few member when i was posting lots of information about the negative health effects of cannabis, but i was just trying to balance out the debate, what the point of a forum if we all think the same way and don't challenge each others ideas ?

[-RC-]

Well that case is describing the behaviours of 1 man as opposed to much broader population studies. Some people just shouldn't do drugs. Any of them.

But then again I agree we need to bring perspective and balance to the subject, particularly where psilocybin mushrooms are concerned.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/staticarchive/889cf19c6200b04ef30790e5bec8fcb7740f0789.jpg

[Yeti101]

Clearly all psychedelics carry at least some risk. Law-reform advocates should not pretend that their pet substance is 100% safe as it's the first thing their opponents will point out. (change is not, AFAIK, opposed to reform, but he is trying to keep us honest). There's no need to sugar coat the risks associated with psychedelic use, as the risk (IMHO) seems to be lower than so many other substances like alcohol and paracetamol, or activities such as traveling in a car, horse riding, cheerleading etc.

I suspect that prohibition isn't actually about risk. It's often about other unstated things that are unacceptable or immoral. If, for the sake of argument, a night on the booze, and a night on shrooms carried exactly the same physical and psychological risk, there are plenty of people, especially politicians, who would still be against legalising shrooms. Why? because deep down, they think tripping is more immoral than being pissed.

Talking about relative harm is important, but it's only half the picture.

[Heretic]

Yes , nothing is without risk , however I suspect that psychedelics will some day prove to be most helpful therapeutic psychological medications . I believe such a study is recently being done in Switzerland .

I think it is time for a big re - think , and a return for psychedelics to be legally accessible without all the hype and stupidity of the '60s that led the them being indiscriminately outlawed .

[Paradoxical]

I am probably 'preaching to the choir' here but the general consensus is that set and setting play a significant role in a situation where psychedelics are experienced. Most importantly this includes the frame of mind that the individual is in. Being under the influence of psychedelics when you have unresolved issues, or are experiencing hard times, or for a large number of reasons you do not under stand your own mind (and are not stable), normally results in those things getting brought forward and you are forced to face it. Now wether you are actually capable of dealing with what ever comes up is another question.

The second thing is dosage, most people that take psychedelics do so in a responsible and cautious manner. I assume its because of the first point that I was taking about. Unlike alcohol, which is generally consumed to excess and causes sedation and inebriation, at higher doses psychedelics can quickly overwhelm an individuals senses and frame of reference to the situation they are in. Psychedelics do not have the depressant effect of the bodies central nervous system that alcohol does, and what that means is when combined with a situation when an individual is overwhelmed and having a bad-trip (I hate to use that term), they are still very capable of doing any thing they can to try and escape the situation they think they are in - that may be running away, trying to self harm or hurting others close by (I have been in a situation where this occurred as a consequence).

Thirdly, how an individual deals with the trip in the following days can also have a significant effect on their life and frame of mind, especially if they had a highly negative experience.

[Change]

Thanks for taking the time to read that Journal abstract RC

Your quite correct in pointing out the problems with that study, one person isnt a good sample size indeed

I was more interested in reading about A causal connection between suicidal behaviour and previous ingestion of psychoactive mushrooms is discussed. but i dont have access to the full paper

Its a good thing to be critical of any study, if we all worshiped sciences journals we would be just like the rest of the bible bashers that dont ask question just preach a book that lots of them havnt even read.

@ Yeti - yes your right, im not opposed to law reform, personally i feel the reason why we see so little reform is due to having highly bias advocates on either side of the argument, and very few people who can put their bias (for either side, pro & anti) aside to access the facts in an independent and impartial manner.

@ most people that take psychedelics do so in a responsible and cautious manner.

If people consumed psychedelics like they consume alcohol @ my local pub then it would be rather problematic to say the least

Looking at the Aussie drinking culture, its fair to say most dont treat alcohol in a responsible and cautious manner so why should we assume people would to such a thing with psychedelics?

[-RC-]

A good read on Australian 'culture', part of which is consumption of alcohol, is The Great Australian Stupor by Ronald Conway.

Fortunately part of psychedelic use is the sometimes harrowing nature of a trip which contributes massively to their non-addictive nature. Most regular users would attest to the fact that they need to really psyche themselves up to higher doses (5g + of cubensis strength say) as they know there will be some sort of work they will be required to do in order to traverse their journey adequately, whatever that means. That and the very rapid onset of tolerance makes abuse of psychedelics like mushrooms much more difficult than with drugs like alcohol.

That being said there is the potential for abuse in everyone of us, be it drug,physical or otherwise. I guess it depends on just how realised that latent potential is in the individual regarding how and what makes it manifest, and in the way it does?

[etherealdrifter]

change so is it that cat that particularly shits you, you know , the one that talks all about spiritual beings that materialize out of no where? You know, they reckons that those beings keep him alive and sane. Or is the fact that science and maths cannot be on the same bell curve in your physical universe?

Man, i love reading the vigour in your posts. Lately though, you are displaying anger and frustration more - than the usual cool dissection of the current proposed thread argument.

Spring has sprung and it naturally inspires nurturing growth. Maybe you have a lot of pentup planting energy.

Plant some seeds man.

I too have seen the jasmine in my backyard putting out wee flowers. Ano i love that scent so much too, makes me go oingo boingo in a good way.

maths and science and shit are actually all interwoven with the life we are experiencing the way we see it individually.

Just thinking about the meaning of our existence is an answer to atleast two of your meandering musings about rants about cunts that shit me because all they talk about is Gaia is all encompassing.

hope you are growing some seedlings don't let the hooks hook ya.

[toby]

Strange to choose change as a name, then chase a static answer?

Have enjoyed reading too, hope you're doing ok:)