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mutant

Disturbing films: name some and why you list them

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First of all I want to ask bot6: if "A Serbian film" was not one of the most extreme for him, then what was, in the horror department.

nothing in the horror film department. i don't find horror films particularly interesting. i watch movies to be intellectually and/or visually engaged. horror movies don't do that for me. in terms of "a serbian film" it seemed its sole purpose was to choose several social taboos and have people pretend to do that. in the end all it amounted to was a 30 second cutaway of a gimp simulating sex with a doll, and 60 odd minutes of some guy on drugs fucking everything in sight. i fell asleep half way through the first time because it was so boring but i gave it a second go and really lost interest after about 30 minutes. now onto antichrist.

And yeah, "Antichrist" is pretty full on and deserves to be on a such a list. Many people state they couldn't handle the film.

yes, the reason antichrist was so disturbing for me was because of "the vibe". the whole thing was sinister from the moment the car rolls through the forest right through to the end. obviously there was a lot of overt imagery which i'm still yet to fully take in but the not-quite subliminal video effects for me really fucked with my my perception. it was kind of like the subject matter is disturbing in itself but periodically there's these subliminal effects which leave you off guard but you don't get time to incorporate them properly before some of the other more overtly disturbing story takes over. if it wasn't for these video effects i probably want hold in such high regard.

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now i want to ask a question: how much do soundtracks add to a supposedly disturbing movie? i was thinking about this after seeing several movies which on their own aren't particularly good but their sound track made them really enjoyable for me. in terms of "disturbing" movies the one i'm thinking of is "Sinister (2012)". the soundtrack to that was just brilliant and made what would otherwise be a mediocre movie really quite good IMO.

your thoughts?

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I don't think he said he's into torture porn did he? That would be kinda messed up. I didn't know such a genre exist unless u wanna call maxhardcore kinda stuff torture which it certainly can appear to be and is pretty messed up, which he did actually do some time for?

Edited by incognito

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I guess what I want to say is that I have been watching lots of films of that sub-genre called torture porn. Indeed these film's most basic purpose is to shock. And most of them manage to deliver the shock / disturbing factor in one way or another. The point is: are they impressive? are they powerful? are they smart? and so on.... do they have depth? are the characters and plot bnelievable? etc.

He did, but I think it's not what I presumed it to be.

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Actually that antichrist with willem dafoe looks a good movie. He usually picks his roles pretty well. Might check it out :)

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Ceres>

"torture porn" is a term, used negatively mostly referring to a modern wave of horror films implementing torture as a big part of the plot and the horror itself. Many 'serious' horror fans and cinephiles use this term disparagely to point out the low quality of such works, making a parallel with pornography. Torture porn does not imply sexual content, well not necessarily.

The comment on the combination of sex and horror deserves a reply as well though: this has been a common theme in art and especially horror and thriller films. And it even derives from real life. Think off how many crimes are done out of lust and sexual passion. What I understand is that the more intensely and realistically a violent story is depicted , the more possible it is some kind of reaction occurs - that is some people are annoyed and really disturbed to the point of calling the film a 'bad influence on society'. Also you can have violence with comedy, and its OK, but when you depict violence as horrific, its not OK anymore. But to me, showing the violence as it is, is much more open, honest than hidding it or shooting hundreads of bullets in your films, with minimum actual casualties shown.

I also want to add that I was a fan of extreme and splatter cinema long before this new sub-genre earthed. Am I glad it earthed? heck yeah, many of those films are nasty wannabe shockers, but some of them I have found immensly exciting and enjoyable. Sorry for that, but I did not make those films, I just want to discuss about them, readily drawing lines to separate the pure exploitation from the important work and also why we watch them and why we are disturbed by them.

About Happiness (note this is not a horror film, I highly recommend). I find this film a masterpiece, hillarious, one of the best black comedies ever made, full of intelligent irony, yet you wonder what the "cultural merit" of this film was. This film is a relentless satire on mankind and especially America, it is beyond me how someone would not see the social commentary in such a rich in meanings film. I recommended this film to a couple , friends of mine, suggesting it was an awesome black comedy and one of the best discoveries of mine in a loing time. To my surprise, when we talked again and they had seen the film, the guys had missed the whole comedy part and took the film as a straightforward drama, describing it almost unbareable.

Well, it was a given from the begining this film is not for every one. None is for everyone, and challenging director know or learn sooner or later that some people are gonna hate your movie whatever it is. Do you ever read about the creators of such films, especially since you wonder why he made that film? Please read interviews of Todd Solondz to find out. IMO this is one the most interesting directors working.

Happiness (1998) is one of the best black comedies ever made and people disturbed by it will never change anything about the films importance and commentary on the sickness of todays societies - on the contrary, they only validate its importance and impact.

PS: BTW, inco, how do you know Max Hardcore? because you are a sick Sagitarrian, Sagis are well know perverts!

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bot6

you seem to be enjoying films in a videoclip kind a way

you also say you do not find horror films particularly interesting nor disturbing.

Well I find it pretty hard to believe that someone that takes no interest in horror films would see Human Centipede or Serbian film, let alone learn about the latter. From time to time I have seen responses like yours, like 'horror's not doing it for me' , 'not interesting' but I tend to doubt these responses. I cannot imagine how someone who doesn't find horror interesting would decide to see so extravagant extreme horror films. There's something missing here. How does a non-fan learn about these films anywayz?

i fell asleep half way through the first time because it was so boring but i gave it a second go and really lost interest after about 30 minutes.

sorry I insist, but I dont understand, did you watch the whole film or not?

So there's no horror/thriller you like and if there's not horror you find disturbing, what other movies have you to propose for our disturbing list besides Antichrist? what films do you find NOT boring?

In regards with Antichrist, I want to see once more, but I believe the reasons why it created such a reaction is for what it implies. I want to re-explore that, but I believe Von Trier plays with the audience here, he plays a game with archetypes , he creates a situation where woman is the devil, I liked it both as a film, and a provocative situation, the game it plays to men and women alike. In men it hits the patriarchical nerves, in woman it's probably more complicated...

....

on the question, yeah sure music plays a big role in the success of a film. Many examples and this is true in every genre, not only thrillers. It is true that a somewhat mediocre or even plotless film can be successful, when sound editing is good, its that videoclip thing I mentioned. I had done a couple mini films in 2005-2006 so I have put this in practice.

One of the best examples of a mediocre film that is saved by the amazing and tense soundtrack and editing is an asian thriller, The eye (2002) , pretty famous back then, it was even remade I think.

but at the end of the day, Antichrist was much more than this, there is deep context, yeah its kind of subliminal, but its there.

one of the best videoclippy editing still, is "Natural Born Killers (1994)" ,

also one of the best sound work IMO is also present in David Lynch's masterpiece "Eraserhead" (sound done by Lynch himself)

Edited by mutant

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Inco reminded me on the other thread.

Apocalypto (2006) and Passion of Christ (2004)

I saw both recently, pretty full on and disturbing. Apocalypto is much better as a film, pretty striking, original and very well made. Passion is very violent & interesting, but you know the spoilers!

Love Gibson for these brave films he made.

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Hey Mutant, I have to admit to getting a kick out of twisted movies too. A couple you should check out are

Excision

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1984153/?ref_=fn_al_tt_1

Anti Christ - Edit, it was already mentioned. Still worth watching though.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0870984/?ref_=fn_tt_tt_1

And.. if you have the stomach for it... :puke:

Feed

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0445965/?ref_=fn_al_tt_1

Art is subjective, just ask Giger.

Edited by muskrat

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[[[[loaded mode on, but I got the grip of it, hold on]]]]]]]

At last! a fan! He ADMITS to being a fan... reluctantly ... could we say??

I am kool if this is just a listing

but hey "you admit to getting kick out of some twisted stuff" - fuck, you're saying it as if it were illegal!???!?!

I really encourage talk about analytics of disturbance and films

spit out your favourites, as well as 'shockers', shockers being films that might freek you out, but you still dont see some merit in them.. but you still wanna mention them as they are 'something' themselves in the disturbing depertment.

Fuck, screw spoilers, if you wanna talk about why a film disturbed you so much, then by all means reveal the fucking spoiler... talk about the specifics and why YOU were disturbed annoyed, even insulted. This goes both to the fans or "naysayers"

but anyways, its cool as is, telling about those films, and listing some that might not be so famous.

but please

and you muskrat, now that you have admitted GUILTY of enojoying such sick films, please tell us more...

there cannot be only those 3 films that you find disturbing. Please write about the films that disturbed you most , and why.

Man I beg you

lets get into what is the nature of the kick when wtching such films....

Peace

mutant, 'pro' cactus cultivator and a totally non-violent person.... well he often uses violent tone is debates ....

Edited by mutant

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I have also happily taken up a project about writing a series articles session on disturbing films for an e-mag, so now I have the official investigator flu, and I am not interested in talkin only about listing the fucking films. Even though I can always ask people

I still have no answers from people that implied these films are a negtive inlfuence or meaningless creations.

where do you draw the lines? there's no "disturbing film" you felt it had a reason of existence, or was even though provoking?

****

muskrat>>>

thanks for the suggestion on

Excision (didn't know about his one) seems pretty nice, even though its really hard for comedies, even comedy horror to make it to a "most disturbing films" list. Will definately check out soon.

I changed my mind about "Bad Boy Buddy" . Indeed I am thinking of a wider list of films of disturbing films, even though they didn't especially annoy me - in fact, fuck, this film Bad Boy Buddy has been in my mind since I saw it, I look forward to seeing with company, this film is easily aiming for the uncharted all time favourites. I mean, what a fucking film, It begins having you thinking it would be one example of torture-porn, many years before the term was even invented. Fuck this must be one of the all time masterpieces, never mind if "pussies" dont get it. We get it.

And I will most probably forward "Happiness" as a fine example too...

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Eckhart tolle would say that these movies appeal to the pain body, and that the pain body strengthens itself through your viewing them. Hence why the "news" is always bad- it appeals to the collective pain body and strengthens it. Pain body being all the collected emotional pain u have accumulated throughout ur life, loves to relive itself through watching violent movies, violence and tragedy on the news etc, and if you identify with your pain body which is completely a seperate entity to who you are, you generally are a pretty fucked up person lol- or sumtin like Dat :)

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i always thought bad boy bubby as more of a "black comedy"

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Can i add It would be nice if you guys gave a little description of what the film is about..... i don't want to be looking up all the movie titles only to find they are not anything i would ever be interested in!

Thank you!

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jwerta>>

all the films mentioned are interesting in the disturbing department

I have made descriptions on most I have mentioned, but I dont do spoilers nor reveal plots, just give a general idea.

I have written quite extensively, so you can google those easily on imdb, see posters or plot outline if you like.

since I have given the year the film was made this is very easy!

Or lets put it like that, since I am an expert or so it seems here, tell me what you would be interested into, and I will recommend you some films.

None of these films is for everyone, so .... ?

bot6, Bad Boy Bubby is definately a black comedy, maybe the best there ever was , but clearly some will not take it so lightly, especially after the first 20minutes. Also Bad Boy Bubby must be one of the most openly atheist films ever, and this is another reason to love it.

Incognito>>

you are describing a full on masochist. I mean who in their right mind would see such films if they indeed had traumatic thought of the past and all. As far as I understand, most people enjoy these films in a morbid curiocity sense, of seeing stuff they would never happen to them, and not seeing them in order to relive and/or enhance the inner physical/psychic struggle.

and dont forget nothing is only physical its always interactive with the emotional and instinctual

Edited by mutant
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Bad Boy Bubby is a brilliant movie imo. Probly my all time fav movie. Get past the first 30 minutes and it's one of the most beautiful films ever.

A Serbian Film - another movie well done, while I would not describe it as disturbing the last 15 minutes is BRUTAL, really brutal.

Pink Flamingos and Salo (120 days of Sodom) I found extremely out there, while I didn't find either disturbing just taboo/bizzare

Vase de Noces also known as The Pig Fucking Movie not sure if this baby has got a mention yet but is some of the weirdest shit I seen. Plenty of scenes in this movie to cause some disturbance.

Irreversible wouldn't describe the entire film as disturbing just the rape scene in it, something real about it.

Cannibal Holocaust another movie well done and extremely brutal. I did find the Animal Cruelty disturbing and unnecessary.

I Spit On Your Grave is probs the most disturbing movie I have seen. Perfect example of torture porn. The last 30 minutes where she gets her revenge is an awesome horror/revenge film but I found the first hour well...disturbing and unnecessary. No need to drag any rape scene out for the majority of a movie when its a simple revenge movie.

while we are talking horror any one seen Teeth? That's some D grade funny shit right there, probs not worth the watch except when the crab goes for a walk with his pecker.

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The Cellar Door

This is a shock movie, I found it extremely boring and badly put together, some guy kidnaps women and locks them in his basement etc. I wouldn't recommend it but I think it falls into this category. More mentally disturbing than because of any gore.

Wolf Creek

This is another Aussie film, it came out a few years ago. This one will hit home with people that have gone camping before and stopped in at random towns meeting some people who just aren't right that look at you in the same way. This is a good film recommended by me.

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muskrat>>>

I have seen Feed, its decent.

I saw Excision, its original and nicely sick.

Nothink>>

A serbian film is up there at the top IMO. It's not the most unpleasant film ever to watch I give you that, and that makes it even more disturbing.

Irreversible is indeed one strong and memorable experience

and Teeth is awesome comedy horror, propably fits well in these lists, I thought it was pretty cool and definately original... not D-grade in my book this is some nice change from all the man-dominated horror and horror comedy. I strongly recommend Teeth.

Pink Flammingos I think its hillarious, its comedy, I love John Waters, but hey it can be pretty disturbing to the conservative minded and the politically correct which is exactly what makles it so funny.

Thanks for new recommendations, that Vase de Noces sounds about right

I haven't seen the original I spit on your grave. Have you seen the remake?

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Vace de Noces was a young Hillbillys breakthrough acting role into the world of beast movies.

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Saw another one last night

Naked blood (1997)

japanese. keywords: self mutilation

it involves a medical experiment gone wrong, and a cactus, yeah a columnar cactus (Could be an Eulychnia). The heroine has found a system to connect electrically with the cactus to "meditate". Anyhow, someone behind the film liked cacti and it shows even in some of the dialogues.

"I though you hated plants"

"Not cacti. They dont talk"

Also I could not identify the cactus.

Low budget, but decent, there's not much violence, but when it finally surfaces its pretty good (or pretty nasty, if you like) and disturbing.

Also

Funny games (1997) , non violent and ultra disturbing masterpiece , remaked in 2007

American mary (2012), a super original tale on the body modification scene, not your typical horror, extremely interesting

Pathology (2008) , another original shocker, smart and medical, keywords: necrophilia

Johnny got his gun (1977) , non horror anti-war drama

Oldboy (2003) , that one is pretty famous

*****

Chained looks interesting, got to love a well made serial killer film

****

also, for Ceres and all naysayers, if she's still reading this thread, quotes from oldboy director, answering the questions:

whats the point in making these films, what they offer, what is their merit and all....

Basically, I'm throwing out the question 'When is such violence justified?' To get that question to touch the audience physically and directly - that's what my goal is. In the experience of watching my film, I don't want the viewer to stop at the mental or the intellectual. I want them to feel my work physically. And because that is one of my goals, the title 'exploitative' will probably follow me around for a while.

and

Living without hate for people is almost impossible. There is nothing wrong with fantasizing about revenge. You can have that feeling. You just shouldn't act on it.

and

Numerous times I lie in bed at night and imagine the cruellest torture. I imagine the most miserable ruining of that person's life. After that, I can fall asleep with a smile on my face. As long as it stays in the realm of imagination, the crueller the better - that's healthy. I'd like to recommend it to you all as well. I hope my films can help in any small way to help your imagination become at least a little bit crueller.
Edited by mutant

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Watched the infamous Visitor Q (2001) of Takashi Miike , featured in almost every list disturbing films. Lives up its fame, has some pretty disturbing scenes, even though I liked it better as a fucked up comedy than a horror, well its not a horror: it sure has some comedic and surreal elements but there's not much sound and music.... so its also heavy ... The movie is really weird but if you're not blinded from the disturbing scenes, you might see the point (what the point?)

Its really harder to see "the point" in 2006's Taxidermia. Very well shot, strange as fuck, disgusting and a little bit funny. Very fucking effective... Obscure and unknown film but its one of the most original ones and one of the strangest... Well you have seen at least a couple sick US films. Have you seen a Hungarian?

Edited by mutant

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Arrrr not funny games!!

Where's Solomon, it's his fault I have watched a surprising number of the films you have listed... He loves those fucked up films... When we used to hang out heaps he was always telling me how awesome a film was and then getting me to watch it with him, delighting in my horror... many of those films made me feel like I was tainted through observation.

I think my brain has actually developed a wonderful defence mechanism to deal with all the disturbing films Solomon got me to watch.. I can't remember what even happened...all I remember is feeling sick. Often.

Hey Mutey I watched Black Swan the other day, just for you, well, not really, I wanted to see it anyway, but damn.. That was an awesome movie. I can kinda see what you're getting at now. Not with most of the other disturbers I've seen, but that was one classy film. I liked it a lot. Insanity is a source of intruige for most humans I suppose. Through gauging the insanity of others we can come to see ourselves clearer. Those ballerinas are fucking crazy man. I have known a few, and they make a perfect subject for an exploration of dedication and madness.

Edited by Ceres
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ceres>

hey, glad you liked black swan .. it was a surprise for me..

have you seen bad boy bubby? please do, if you've read along all the thread !!

also see "teeth". both comedies in the broader sense. teeth can be seen like a feminist horror comedy rather lightly, just dont take it too seriously

through this more thorough study which I did for writing the articles on the subject , seeing films I have been missing all along, has me into thinking about it in more ways than before.

from the survey so far, Salo seems to be the most popular and rightfully so

Ceres could you watch Happiness again, thinking this is fiction + comedy ?

other than that I would suggest Cronenberg films. There's violence, but there's because it's requiared by the plot, and its played physically.

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I really enjoyed it, especially the one scene where the black swan had taken her over completely for the first time and was relishing being in full possession of the body. Rolling her shoulders and absorbing the atmosphere, such a cool scene. Reminded me of certain moments when tripin, where a new sense of self becomes apparent, all the smells, sounds, textures and feelings are experienced a-new. Buzzed me out that wee scene.

Yep seen bad boy bubbly... Felt sick when he wraps the cat in glad wrap. I don't know what to say about it otherwise.. Some ppl's lives are crazy eh. I suppose it gives insight to why some ppl are the way they are.

..and yep seen teeth too. Didn't think it was that great lol. Seemed like it was kinda low budget or sum thing.

Nooooo way will I watch happiness again! I can respect this is your slant on it. But yick. Not puttin myself through that movie again soz.

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