Jump to content
The Corroboree
Sign in to follow this  
Sallubrious

Breeding Psychotria

Recommended Posts

Every time I look at my P.nexus plants lately I really appreciate the value of them but I can't help thinking that the job has only been half done.

To my way of thinking if the plant had been back crossed with the viridis the full potential of the viridis could be attained as far as alkaloids go. If it had the cold tolerance of a carth then it would be a much desired plant.

If two separate crosses were done from the same parents with one line being bread for size & cold tolerance and another line bred specifically for alkaloid content and the two lines crossed when the traits were fixed a plant could be produced that could have enormous potential.

Most likely two separate lines would not need to be started, it's just that two separate lines would make it easier to fix specific traits and not rely on as much luck.

I'd love to do this myself, but I don't have an environment that a viridis will thrive in so it's all just a pie in the sky really.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

nice thought!

I think there is a small chance that this happened already, with the nexus seeds, which formed on my plant, or even the seeds, which were produced on my viridis "moon".

the problem is, that most people say, there nexus never sets seeds! one can't breed a plant, if it never fruits, and/or the few seeds produced never germinate. but, as said initialy, some people managed to get seed, but none have germinated so far...

another thing could be that, the vigorous and cold hardiness traits, might get reduced, at the same time, one breeds more alks into the plant. anyway, time will tell.

yet another issue, at least for myself, would be, that I would not like to work with somebody else's creation (so as to take those peoples glory away).

I am for example would not be happy, if people, would trade say a red narrow leaved as there own creation.

neither would it be ok for me, for example, to probagate, nexus plants and sell them...

we would have to ask, h c & m permission....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was thinking that the offspring wouldn't have to set seeds, it would be back crossed with the viridis parent so all that would be needed would be pollen.

So ideally one line would be the way to breed them and the sterile seed problem from the offspring shouldn't be an issue.

I certainly wouldn't want to pass it off as someone elses work, Darren did a great service by breeding the Nexus.

A plant with two different parents from Darrens' would be an entity unto itself. I suppose it would be common courtesy to have his input on the naming of the hybrid if it ever did eventuate.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

there is a chance, that my "moon" was pollinated by a nexus.

I am not sure entirely, but I think to remember that, many people had the opinon, that nexus's pollen is sterile.

looking forward what others think.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If the pollen is sterile then that would certainly bring the idea to a grinding halt.

I wonder if the sterile pollen issue is specific to the nexus & would the offspring from two different parents of slightly different lineage exibit that trait too.

Edited by SallyD

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I might throw in a few more random ideas, to the subject "breeding psychotria".

regarding the nexus, we have to find out why, she hardly set's seed, and if, than why they don't germinate.

I thought at times that, the flowering time are out of whack with other psychotrias, and this is why she, never re produces. I hope other people can shed more light onto this idea.

another reason could be, that a nexus flower, has problems being pollinated. if you put pollen onto the stigma of such a flower, the pollen will not move down to the ovaries, but at times this can be overcome by cutting the style, with a razor blade, and then adding the pollen, onto the surface of the cut. this will allowe than the pollen to move to the ovaries. in short, this overcomes a defect stigma.

if nothing is wrong with the stigma, style, ovaries and so, and the pollen is sterile, one could try, to grow plants, just out of the pollen, via tissue culture, I suppose.

we have to find out, if the male parts don't work or the female, or both...

I quickly add here, that nexus seeds are peculiar, in a sense that, the fruit will contain, one very big seed, and one very small seed. other psychotrias produce seeds of same size.

this thread, gave me the idea, that we could try as well to, cross viridis plants, with (total different) other psychotrias!!

in other words cross it with, a ground covering psychotria, and get a plant, which would hide the potential and the origin (nobody would know what it is!!!)

or try to cross with a native psychotria, and get a miniature plant.

try to cross it with a coffee plant and get hallucinogenic, coffee beans, hahaha (probably not possible).

Edited by planthelper
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So does anyone know where "La Luna" originated from and what the parents might be or if its just a stranded viridis from a different part of south america

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So does anyone know where "La Luna" originated from and what the parents might be or if its just a stranded viridis from a different part of south America

tort, said in this(http://www.shaman-australis.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=28364&page=1) post # 13:

'La luna' is a clone of a plant that is dear to the Santo Daime in australia and we originally called it 'moon', but then realised there is a conflict with that name so quickly changed it to 'la luna'. The most distinct feature is that it has rounded leaf tips and very short internodal length. A very compact plant.

this reminds me, to call this plant "la luna", and not "moon" in the future (old habits are hard to break).

Edited by planthelper

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

yeah i was wondering what you were on about, i thought you might of had a different variety maybe. La Luna , UDV and nexus are my fav of them all. I would love to cross luna and udv

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is turning into an educational thread.

Maybe we need a list of all the species/cultivars in Australia and their attributes. Appearance, growth rate, cold hardiness, etc.

It's got me interested enough to build something to overwinter them & propagate some virids again myself.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I agree with SallyD, great thread with even more potential!! I thought I had all strains, but obviously were all shooting a bit short, well most of us ;)

Unfortunately I don't have alot to offer, but ill happily list the strains I have;

Regular

Moon

Shipibo

Alba

Carthagensis

What's to add? UDV...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can't forget the nexus & alphabetised to cater for my OCD.

alba - carthaginensis synonym ?
carthaginensis

Moon - viridis cultivar

nexus - viridis * carthaginesis hybrid

Regular - viridis cultivar
Shipibo - viridis cultivar

UDV - viridis cultivar

Feel free to correct the nomenclature and taxonomy - capitalisation etc

Edited by SallyD

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

people, check out member mauve posts, at the psychotria id threads.

I will add the link, hopefully later.

mauve discovered, that our regular viridis, has a name and is in fact a rare treat, but common in oz.

I remember an other post, by a member who's name now escapes me, but I mean the post, which uses Spanish names for the plants in question.

I remember only one name though, shipibo = Ojo rojo = red eye. it referes to the red colored stipules!!

all the posts I refer to, are located at the id sub forum.

Edited by planthelper
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have recently heard about a special viridis strain called 'white princess' I think, that has an exceptionally high alkaloid content.

Apparently a single leaf has been used to make an active brew!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I remember an other post, by a member who's name now escapes me, but I mean the post, which uses Spanish names for the plants in question.

I remember only one name though, shipibo = Ojo rojo = red eye. it referes to the red colored stipules!!

all the posts I refer to, are located at the id sub forum.

It was this post (I think):

http://www.shaman-australis.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=28364&p=351577

Link to the Brazilian forum in question: https://www.plantasenteogenas.org/threads/6-tipos-de-chacronas-estudos-e-identificacao.3452/

Edited by Yeti101

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

White Princess is in Australia and I have heard of its potency from several reputable sources

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've heard of a PV plant that requires 6 leaves for an "intense" brew, also from reputable sources. Also in Australia.

Have not seen the plant myself, nor have access to it unfortunately.

Not sure if its the same "White Princess", but it could very well be.

Edited by Justler

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah you've got to wonder why those lines haven't filtered through and made their way into the wider community.

Maybe they are an inner circle thing that's only suitable for real hardheads or they have a dark twist to them?

Maybe there's a commercial interest involved. Given the lack of bulk leaf in Oz, it could be a guarded resource for selfish greedy reasons.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When I first heard about it (probably around march/april) I was under the impression that it had only recently made it's way to Oz.

I guess the season for growth was also coming to an end at that time. I guess it just needs some time before it starts spreading.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

:drool2:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

×