Slybacon

Mitragyna speciosa (Kratom) methods for ingestion

46 posts in this topic

Mitragyna speciosa (Kratom) extracts have been popular around the world for some time. I have searched the forum and read around and I am having trouble finding clear instructions on the best way to get the most out of this product. I have recently been given the opportunity to bio essay and am waiting for the arrival a 15g batch of 20:1 extract to arrive at my holiday destination.

I have a high opiate/opioid tolerance both natural and developed. I have found that using DXM lowers this threshold but not considerably. I am interested in getting the lovely effect I get from a range of opiates and opioids from kratom. I am interested in higher range experiences. I have read methods ranging from chews to teas and also smoking.

Can we propagate this thread with peoples techniques and suggestions for getting the most out of these extracts with 20:1 ratio or similar. From what I can tell a good strong dose of this extract is 1 to 2g. So what ways should I try to ingest. Would also like comments on things that may potentate the experience. Do the same potentiators as with opiates prove to be effective. Things like Anti-Histamines, Grapefruit Juice, Benzos etc.

Thanks for the advice, sorry if it has been covered but I thought a thread that was less discussion and more reports on how to get the most out of the experience and detailed methods of preparation and ingestion .

Sly

Edited by Slybacon

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Using these sorts of plants only once a week max is the best method of ensuring good effects, unless you want terrible withdrawals.

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Thanks for the advice- So I am assuming an up-regulation of the mu-opioid receptors gives a withdraw similar to other opiates. Does anyone know the active ingredients half-life to give an indication of the acuteness and length of withdrawals. Does it cause PAWS and how would you compare it to other opiate withdrawals. To be honest I think the Kratom will most likely help with the withdrawal from other opiates. One of the reasons I am researching this substance.

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I found a daily kratom tea very useful to combat oxycontin withdrawal. It enabled me to reduce the dose by 50% initially, then stop altogether two weeks later, instead of the gradual step down recommended by my GP that would have taken 5 months. Mild withdrawal symptoms were still experienced, but nothing like without the kratom.

Unfortunately I don't recall the kratom dosage.

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Also, I have heard that Artemisia capillaris potentiates the effects of kratom. I'd be interested to hear of anyone has any experience with this combination.

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Has anyone got any experiences to report from the sab product? I'm pretty keen to try but don't wanna outlay 80 beans on something not worth it.

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Oh if your using it to help come off prescription drugs you might have some success but I have also heard of people using chinese herbs to help withdrawals. If you tell a TCM practitioner what your problem is they will make you up a nice mixture of herbs that help. Corydalis is one herb that helps with opiate withdrawal but these herbs might be of more use to you towards the end of your detox otherwise they might not be strong enough for you. Get fit with some daily exercise will make the difference between manageable withdrawals and intense withdrawals. Good luck

Toast how long did the Kratom withdrawals last when you ceased use of it or did you taper your dose till at a extremely low dose?

Edited by Leaves

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I found a daily kratom tea very useful to combat oxycontin withdrawal. It enabled me to reduce the dose by 50% initially, then stop altogether two weeks later, instead of the gradual step down recommended by my GP that would have taken 5 months. Mild withdrawal symptoms were still experienced, but nothing like without the kratom.

Unfortunately I don't recall the kratom dosage.

whats was your dose of oxycontin?

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I would recommend starting with a very low dose. Kratom has a range of effects most of which are altogether different to opiates. Large doses can be highly unpleasant.

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i will be encapsulating some tomorrow and seeing where that gets me.

maybe around .5g for starters then changing my dose from their.

im hoping .5 will give me the stim effects and larger doses the noddy effects.

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Slybacon - interesting topic, thanks for starting it!

I don't have any personal experience with kratom WDs, but alot of people on the SomniForum were taking it and reported that they were quite mild - to the extent that many users refuse to believe that kratom is a "proper" opioid at all. I lost all my notes on the topic years ago, but as I recall it has a complex pharmacology, with interesting stuff like partial mu-agonism (like buprenorphine) which might help to account for the reduced withdrawals. So yes, it'll probably help with other wd's, but you might not get strong recreational effects if your habit is large.

Edited by Anodyne

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Still be careful with Kratom as I have read of it affecting peoples lives that much that they are stuck, have to hang around their homes because of the addiction, can't travel anywhere. Many need benzo's to calm the anxiety of Kratom withdrawals and are just terribly depressed.

Still it sounds like an ok idea to help come off opoids gently. Slow taper is the only way if you have to keep up appearances at work.

Edited by Leaves

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Oh if your using it to help come off prescription drugs you might have some success but I have also heard of people using chinese herbs to help withdrawals. If you tell a TCM practitioner what your problem is they will make you up a nice mixture of herbs that help. Corydalis is one herb that helps with opiate withdrawal but these herbs might be of more use to you towards the end of your detox otherwise they might not be strong enough for you. Get fit with some daily exercise will make the difference between manageable withdrawals and intense withdrawals. Good luck

Toast how long did the Kratom withdrawals last when you ceased use of it or did you taper your dose till at a extremely low dose?

I used a range of TCM herbs supplied by a senior forum member to assist with detox process including corydalis. These worked very well, the guy really knew his stuff :worship: I'll contact him & see if he minds me posting the full list of what I took.

I didn't experience any withdrawal when I stopped the kratom tea.

whats was your dose of oxycontin?

I'm not sure, they were a foggy 6 months, but I know that I was getting 30mg tablets towards the end & I would have had around 10 a day :blink:

.... but you might not get strong recreational effects if your habit is large.

I have never experienced any psychoactive effects from kratom, either during this detox period (3 years ago) or since, although I've hardly touched it since.

I would expect that I've done some damage to my opiate receptors, although I admittedly have no knowledge of pharmacology & brain chemistry.

Edited by toast
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Yeah the 4-5 day withdrawal of Kratom sounds a million times better than the up to 3 months withdrawal people experience after daily buprenorphine usage. The government should take note if they really want to help people suffering from opiate/opoid addiction

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Thanks for the input.

Im not currently withdrawing, but I step on and off with my opiate use and would be pleased if kratom offered a nice buzz to taper back with. Even if its just a slight relief from the crippling demotivation that comes after a week on the opiates. Also interested if its got merit on its own as a relaxing post work tea or joint. Interested to see how Spacemonks dosage regime works out.

Edited by Slybacon

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When the Kava Hut in Cairns used to sell shots of Kratom I would have 3 x 5 grams max over about 8 hours (not extract) and I found it hard to stay sitting on the stool at the bar. Very sedating & euphoric for me. But if you still have a tolerance to opoids then your dosage would need to be higher so its hard to say how much you would need. I would start small, then work your way up, but your most likely not going to get much pleasure from it until tolerance has dropped.

Edited by Leaves

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Being in Europe, I have had a chance to explore kratom a bit. Extracts are good for ease of transportation, but high quality raw powdered material can deliver strong effects with as little as one teaspoon. There is a spectrum of alkaloids so perhaps some are missed wih certain extractions. The effects can come in between 30 to 60 minutes, with a very nice euphoria that lasts for 1 to 2 hours. Some nausea can be experienced here especially at high doses. For me the pleasant euphoria then gives way to an unpleasant 'scattered' state of mind that often makes me regret having taken it. This seems a quite different state to the sedation due to opiates, so those attempting to replace opiates with kratom should proceed with caution. But this could be an individual response.

The best way to use it IMO is crude ground raw material steeped in boiling water, about one gram. Anything more gives me unpleasant side effects as noted. An interesting effect of kratom is increased stamina. One feels like they could run walk swim fly forever.... A useful effect at times! Good for howling at the moon etc.

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Also while I remember it, I had a chance to visit a few of the happy high herb shops that are sprouting up all over California recently. There kratom is the number one product. Te friendly girl behind the counter explained the different qualities of the red, white etc strains, and how to make tea out of it etc. lots of cliched Cali surfer dudes coming in proclaiming 'that stuff is awesome bro!'. Indeed.

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edit : irrelevant to the discussion

Edited by Leaves

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Leaves, each HHH store in australia is owned by a different individual, so making sweeping statements like that is neither fair nor correct and potentially leaves you open to legal action.

No one from the newtown store has been charged. if you are talking about the dramas few months ago, then check your facts because this is now actually a courtcase against the media for slander. No drugs were seized at the stores during the raids and all products were handed back to the shops. Don't believe what you see on TV.

There is no problem with criticising, but keep it factual please [as you have with some of your points]. Slandering a business with incriminating statements is the same as incriminating an individual here and is against the rules. I am sure you wouldn't want others going around saying that you were selling drugs if that was not true.

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edit : irrelevant to the discussion, I was just trying to warn members. I will not point out which store sold what & when then.

Edited by Leaves

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we learn the hard way hey leaves :devil: if sum1 is after coke buy coke, if some1 is after mdma buy an E!! i am very keen to try sum kratom<> :wink:

Edited by bullit

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From what I understand, it is not for human consumption.

Elves, mutants, and other distinctly non human entities may feel otherwise.

We love and obey the rules of our Supreme Overlords, in their infinite all seeing wisdom.

 

Edited by shonman
clarifying
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do not ever consume, it is not for human consumption, plants have an energy all their own.

They are also excellent additions to soaps and lotions.

Other people online have said

withdrawal from kratom is nothing to be concerned about....its like quitting drinking coffee

but, as we know, it is not meant to be consumed,

Edited by shonman
clarification

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withdrawal from kratom is nothing to be concerned about....its like quitting drinking coffee

and would you say the same, if you would be using kratom since say 15 years?

hmm, I guess not!

kratom is good for once in a while recreational use, or for helping overcome, opiate withdraw, and this means short term usage.

I agree that solvent and water extractions, might leave behind some very good actives. a very good point, which has been raised...

a tea spoon full of powdered leaves, is a good standard dose, however people with a tolerance to opiods, need far higher doses.

kratom has synergies with some halucigenics.

kratom can make you a bit cosy/sleepy, but when needed gives you energy, sort of, if you rest, it makes you sleepy, but if you are active, it makes you more active. it's possible to go from one phase to the other, repeatedly.

chewing the leaves is a popular method of ingestion as well, but fresh leaves are too, vibrant for me.

anyway, using kratom only once in a while, is the way to go.

Edited by planthelper
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