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botanika

Australia the anal country...

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oh man, i just heard on SBS they're trying to raise the legal drinking age too... as if we aren't treated like babies for long enough

[edit] "to combat binge drinking" and "young aggressive drinkers". right

...their solution is to nanny us harder

Here's the thing...in China there is not really any underage drinking problem nor are laws enforced heavily. My wife even used to go buy beers and smokes for her dad as a kid. Young people simply don't drink much even though it's very easy for them to do so. Why? I have some speculative ideas but it would be another long post but in essence I suspect its cultural and genetic influences and very little to do with laws. And maybe also because China has a denser urban environment with shops and restaurants open late and lots of things for young people to do and socialize versus the scattering of people out into lonely sprawling suburbia.

Raising the drinking age would be pointless and would not solve the issue. To change the drinking culture I think you have to change the actual culture, not the laws. Australias drinking culture is primarily a european drinking culture, which is aggressive by nature. Europeans/caucasians are aggressive ice age adapted people - so you get a clash. Young people who like to drink aggressively, older people who like to enforce laws aggressively.

australia the anal CUNTry amirite?

Like the sex pistols... 'or just another CUNTry', 'Oh so pretty, oh so pretty...vacant...we're vaCUNT'

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that's australia's answer to everything it doesn't like.

just slap a law on it. ban it.

that'll solve everything.

fucking australia.

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...because learning from what works for other countries would be just too darn sensible

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in defence of alcohol, i'm kind of drunk right now.

it's pretty good.

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first world bitching :)

more supposed freedom but more laws, dont cross the yellow line, wear a helmet!

good to be able to bitch about such things, then worrying about your next meal.

mwah :wub: whats perfect?

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lets all stop bitching and overthrow the government, to the pitchforks!

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lets go to china and get a 13 year old hooker :BANGHEAD2: FUCK !!! or lets work 16 hour days every fuken day @ age 10 forever :BANGHEAD2:

we , us , aussies have it fuken good..... :wave-finger: 4 the haters

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wow Botanika....really?

I'd rather be anal than live and make a living out of China..............a country that Amnesty International says has:

Detention without trial

Death penalty

Has no freedom of expression

etc etc.

http://www.amnestyusa.org/our-work/countries/asia-and-the-pacific/china

Obviously your conscience is clear of all this ? Then you go on to say that one day you'll be coming back home.

What for?

Mate, really? You've befuddled my opinion of you.

So you reckon just because some twat immigration official gave you the shits about your passport it gives you the leadway to payout on Australia?

Man, we all know what Oz is about and yes, the seppos have taken us by the dick (or tits :)) and made us gobble their rhetoric up as gospel truth...........yeah, most of us here in this forum know that but to argue China has lax laws about this and that and therefore it makes it more progressive in some way.

Good on ya mate, glad to hear you and your ex-pat mates are living the high life up there in China.

Buying booze at all hours, experiencing a burgeoning night-life scene and generally making a healthy wage out of a regime that blatantly sticks it's fingers up at any one or group or country etc, that opposes the way it conducts business.

Fuck the AMERICAN government and FUCK CHINA.

I'm proud to live here, that's why my parents immigrated here in 1953. To get away from poverty and oppression.

I feel your argument lacks the fibre of deep thought and if you are just venting anguish at being stopped at the border that's fine but to defend China , that irritates me , even shits me.

Just because you live in Australia and the government stipulates that you-for arguments sake-says you cannot wear yellow g-strings - that doesn't mean everybody has to listen to them.............but atleast i won't be executed at the mcg by some fucking firing squad.

We all have choices in Australia.

I choose to live the way i want in Oz. I take full responsibility for my own actions. If that infringes on antiquated laws .well..........big shit..............i'll take it on counsel. Atleast i'm afforded the oppurtunity to respond to their stupid laws - my choice.

China sucks balls imo and every one has that basic right in Oz. Go and publicly say that in China and see how the Australian consulate treat you.

Let me re-iterate:

i'm all for anal but not FOR China.

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Unfortunately those 10 year old kids are probably making clothes and stuff for wealthy Aussies. It's a world economy, and there's not much we can do about it apart from making ourselves poorer by buying stuff made in Australia. We don't make computers and cheap clothes, unfortunately so we rely on those poor 10 year old kids to make it for us. However, I'm not wealthy by our own standards so it's difficult when I have a little child who needs clothes. And I need the internet to keep myself entertained and in work!

I prefer to live here than the UK, can get better work too, but the main reason I came here is not for the people, the politics, or the culture, but for the landscape. I love this country and I love the environment, the rest needs a bit of work, unfortunately. But that's okay, I'm part of it, so when I criticise it I do include myself. I'm no effing saint.

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Eth Australia isn't exactly dirt free in regards to human rights.

Refugees, the indiginous... I don't think any of us can really comment until we have been to china ourselves. All we know about china is what we have been sold.

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^ i know ingog, i know that.......but does that mean i should just give up? In china we'd be hauled up by the local ,village,council and then handed over to govt interrogation just for having this conversation...meh, i'm just giving my opinion.that's what bot was asking in the first place

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i like living in australia because i get to have a sister

i like living in australia because people dont hawk up and publicly spit anywhere, everywhere, anytime.

i like living in australia because i can practice falun gong, or any other religion/spiritual disipline of my choosing, without fear of persecution & detention.

i like living in australia because we didnt invade and occupy Tibet

i like living in australia bcause if i dont like something the government does, i can safely publicly say so, even by way of mass public protest

i like living in australia because we dont have nuclear power stations scattered everywhere

i like living in australia because because in the cities i can tell the difference between smog & clouds

i like living in australia because i dont feel like i'm living in a complete dog-eat-dog, fuckyou, first-in-first-served society

i like living in australia because i can breathe

*edit- shit spelling

Edited by LokStok
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How do u know that eth ? Fact of the matter is... You don't.

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???? wtf ingog..........these are facts open to anyone .......what do you mean? So according to your rational , if i wasn't 'there' it must be a crock of shit?

>amnesty international are a bunch of crappers and no one ever landed on the moon?

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i like living in australia because i get to have a sister

- true, but if Australia had as many people as China does, you might feel differently

i like living in australia because people dont hawk up and publicly spit anywhere, everywhere, anytime.

- but they do vomit regularly in the street after a night out

i like living in australia because i can practice falun gong, or any other religion/spitual disipline of my choosing, without fear of persecution & detention.

- except if your spirituality includes entheogenics or cannabis

i like living in australia because we didnt invade and occupy Tibet

- but it did invade Indigenous Australia and left behind a broken wreck of a civilisation that still suffers

i like living in australia bcause if i dont like something the government does, i can safely publicly say so, even by way of mass public protest

- true

i like living in australia because we dont have nuclear power stations scattered everywhere

- true, but we do have a few uranium mines

i like living in australia because because in the cities i can tell the difference between smog & clouds

- totally agree, luckily it all blows out to sea (if you've ever driven down from the Blue Mountains to Penrith, you'll realise the air isn't all that clean)

i like living in australia because i dont feel like i'm living in a complete dog-eat-dog, fuckyou, first-in-first-served society

- the socialist protections will be next on the list for Mr Abbott to trash, cheered on by the anti-refugee mob

i like living in australia because i can breathe

- true enough

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sounds like white ''wind'' has a problem with aussieland 2???

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^ i know ingog, i know that.......but does that mean i should just give up? In china we'd be hauled up by the local ,village,council and then handed over to govt interrogation just for having this conversation...meh, i'm just giving my opinion.that's what bot was asking in the first place

Okay, it's not that great. But from what I understand it's usually only the serious activists who are dragged off and interrogated, The Guardian ran a story on some villagers who protested polluting factories for 10 years (including letters to the government and papers) and they got sidelined and ignored, but no-one was dragged off or disappeared. The Western media loves to highlight the worst stories, but you will undoubtedly receive worse violence in areas where government isn't strong, as my cousin found out in his 10 year stay.

Western governments frequently sanction violence against protestors (luckily youtube hasn't been silenced by the NSA - yet) but we also have laws where purported terrorists can get dragged off and disappear without trial. We don't know of any, but that doesn't mean there aren't any.

And I know it's the UK and US mostly, but what about extraordinary rendition and Guantanamo Bay?

Do you feel safer now?

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o yeah i wasnt talkin bout ya clothes u wear white''wind'' its bout the farmers to make coin 2 live.. sounds like u guys think way to hard and cant b happy bout nothing?? life in aussieland fuken roks :devil: JUST FUKEN ENJOY WHAT WE HAVE!!!

Edited by bullit

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your responses are diligent whitewind........thoughtful reasoning. My argument maybe be patchy.but you guys get my drift. Without going into fine detail , you understand that my point is specifically about the human rights that are frequently abused in china.

Australia has a deep rich history that is thousands of years old.i don't ascribe to Europeans story that Australia is only as old as the first steps captain cook took with the first fleet's accounts - after all-Dirk Hartog in 1616 landed here way before him.......

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sounds like white ''wind'' has a problem with aussieland 2???

No, I just like a different perspective. I actually really enjoy living here, wouldn't live anywhere else (this is my home), but there are aspects which could be improved. I also think our own perspective of these things can be a bit skewed - yes we are lucky largely because we run the capitalist society and don't manufacture our goods, and also because it is one of the least populated places on the planet. But we are only lucky because we were born into it.

Like, Lokstok likes Australia because he can have a sister. But would he want a sister if she was forced to work in a brothel at the age of 13, like you said? Maybe it would be better not to have one, reduce the population and share the resources better. China's not the best place to live, no-one can argue that, but it seems strange to criticise an attempt to improve the living conditions for the people who already exist.

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I always hoik up gollies in public, it's a bad habit. Better out than in!

Ill give up my b&h smooths someday.

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your responses are diligent whitewind........thoughtful reasoning. My argument maybe be patchy.but you guys get my drift. Without going into fine detail , you understand that my point is specifically about the human rights that are frequently abused in china.

Australia has a deep rich history that is thousands of years old.i don't ascribe to Europeans story that Australia is only as old as the first steps captain cook took with the first fleet's accounts - after all-Dirk Hartog in 1616 landed here way before him.......

Thanks Eth, I was beginning to wonder what I had got myself in to.. too late to leave now!

I tend to argue the devil's advocate, and I am a bit negative (I admit to that totally)..

Yes, I know human rights aren't the best in China, but there is a skewed view by Western media that highlights the worst and ignores the good news stories which makes it look like hell to live there, but it's a rich and varied culture and society with some good bits as well as the bad.

I have an indigenous Australian friend who is very jealous of his culture, but I am slowly getting him to tell his stories. Lovely lad, from a very rough background but he's proud and trying hard to throw it off.

Anyway, here's an Australian story to make you cry. I challenge anyone not to be brought to tears by this.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/2013/jun/18/rabbit-proof-fence-everlyn-sampi

EDIT to make sense

Edited by whitewind
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yeah all good white wind, there r a hundred things that could b better ... we should stop beening soo negative bout the lil shit !! i have a large family ,broke as fuk , bills up my ass, blah blah fuken blah but fuk it dude life is fuken great in aussieland!!!!!!!

if i loss my job i can get benefits to help live, i can go to the doc,skool, without any dramas!! i can fuken do what ever i want really :devil:

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lets go to china and get a 13 year old hooker :BANGHEAD2: FUCK !!! or lets work 16 hour days every fuken day @ age 10 forever :BANGHEAD2:

we , us , aussies have it fuken good..... :wave-finger: 4 the haters

wow Botanika....really?

I'd rather be anal than live and make a living out of China..............a country that Amnesty International says has:

Detention without trial

Death penalty

Has no freedom of expression

etc etc.

http://www.amnestyusa.org/our-work/countries/asia-and-the-pacific/china

Obviously your conscience is clear of all this ? Then you go on to say that one day you'll be coming back home.

What for?

Mate, really? You've befuddled my opinion of you.

So you reckon just because some twat immigration official gave you the shits about your passport it gives you the leadway to payout on Australia?

Man, we all know what Oz is about and yes, the seppos have taken us by the dick (or tits :)) and made us gobble their rhetoric up as gospel truth...........yeah, most of us here in this forum know that but to argue China has lax laws about this and that and therefore it makes it more progressive in some way.

Good on ya mate, glad to hear you and your ex-pat mates are living the high life up there in China.

Buying booze at all hours, experiencing a burgeoning night-life scene and generally making a healthy wage out of a regime that blatantly sticks it's fingers up at any one or group or country etc, that opposes the way it conducts business.

Fuck the AMERICAN government and FUCK CHINA.

I'm proud to live here, that's why my parents immigrated here in 1953. To get away from poverty and oppression.

I feel your argument lacks the fibre of deep thought and if you are just venting anguish at being stopped at the border that's fine but to defend China , that irritates me , even shits me.

Just because you live in Australia and the government stipulates that you-for arguments sake-says you cannot wear yellow g-strings - that doesn't mean everybody has to listen to them.............but atleast i won't be executed at the mcg by some fucking firing squad.

We all have choices in Australia.

I choose to live the way i want in Oz. I take full responsibility for my own actions. If that infringes on antiquated laws .well..........big shit..............i'll take it on counsel. Atleast i'm afforded the oppurtunity to respond to their stupid laws - my choice.

China sucks balls imo and every one has that basic right in Oz. Go and publicly say that in China and see how the Australian consulate treat you.

Let me re-iterate:

i'm all for anal but not FOR China.

China's a huge place, many provinces. The mainstream reality is not what a lot of people think, otherwise I would not have lived here for so long, nor would many other expats. Nor would the chinese. And don't think they ALL want to immigrate. The new China is a different ball game and you're going to have to get used to it whether you like it or not. They make your clothes and phone and they buy our uranium and minerals and wine. They are buying most of germany's cars. It's not all about sweatshops and human rights. That's a naive view especially when you consider our own history of being overlords. My post was not meant to be china versus Australia and I did qualify I posted it generalized and that Australia is so great in many ways. You don't think I visit Australia or miss it? Of course I do!!! Its my home...here I am just an expat. Nowhere is perfect. Neither am I. But life for me is an adventure. I take on the challenge. I get lost, I find treasure...always seeking. Or should I have just stayed at home and become a plumber? Maybe I should have but happiness is a state of mind, not a location or job or culture.

I never said Im a supporter of China's human rights problems, nor some of its governments control, nor of the terrible environmental pollution (seriously its bad and it will affect other countries down the line). I was more commenting on some day to day differences in a casual way that resulted from a discussion, not with chinese people, but other expats from UK and America and all I can compare australia too, in any detail, is China because that is where I have lived for the last 11 years. I have lived in the UK and the US too but nowhere near as long. I have never seen a 10 year old prostitute nor a 10 year old factory worker. Slavery is relative. No high life (well sometimes) - just life. No matter how much both of us try we will still be generalizing.

If you're not for China that's fine and if you want to start attacking me personally and aggressively that's fine too. If you want to change your opinion of me too that's fine also but I won't change my opinion of you because of your post. I dig ya and I also dig your music. You can try guilt trip me with this 'Botanika really?' shit. I don't really care. It's just more australian jingoism and internet jock talk. I'm immune to that style of internet criticism. And if I choose to live in China or australia it's my choice and I don't have to defend it to you or anyone else. Chillax man, I put this in the bitches and gripes section for a reason. It's not a scientific paper. It's about the potential that Australia is becoming anal. I don't want it to become sweden, china or america. I want Australia to be Australia like anyone else. If I didn't care about Australia I would write my post.

If I was to honestly write a book on china it would be huge because trust me there are many many things that annoy the hell out of me being here. Before you even get to amnesty international there would be a million pages on how chinese people push into ques, spit, talk loudly on the mobile phone in elevators, can't think creatively, toss there garbage on the street because they know someone will pick it up, honk their horns repeatedly, won't hold a door open for you, rush to get on a plane, then make you wait 4 days for a meeting only to be delayed another 2 days on return because of air traffic 'control'. High life. No its ying and yang wherever you are. Trust me man. 11 years. I have volumes of reasons why I want to come back. I have volumes of reasons why I want to stay too.

Edited by botanika
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The question remains ..... Are the ladies hot?? ;)

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