Jox Posted February 15, 2013 Hey all, I just wanted to ask a couple of questions about the Lophophora species. I was wondering were L. koehresii & L. decipiens fit in with other species? I assume that L.koehresii fits under L.Diffusa, making it L.Diffusa var koehresii? I have also read that L.decipiens is a variety of L. williamsii. Another question was about L.ziegleri, is this now called L.Diffusa? I would like to work this out but read lots of conflicting opinions, so I hoping to get a confirmation from my friends here Thanks everyone Cheers jox Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mushroomman Posted February 15, 2013 I have seen L ziegleri in someone's collection b4 and the flowers were the same as his williamsii's so I just assumed they were the same species ? I could be wrong though . I'm pretty sure you are right about koehresii and decipiens . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sallubrious Posted February 15, 2013 I'm not sure what they're calling them these days, but I think you're on the right track with koehresii. My understanding was that it was bred from diffusas collected by European collectors early last century. So I think that would qualify it as a cultivar. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Heretic Posted February 15, 2013 The older literature states that there are only 2 species : L . Williamsii and L . Diffusa . I believe , as Sally D says , L Koehresi was bred in Europe and is some sort of hybrid . However I think the genus was reviwed to include L . Fricci as a sparate naturally occurring species . I don't know about the more recently described species such as L . Jourdania , etc , . But , if l. Williamsi v caespitosa [ and others ] breed true , would that not also mean they are separate species ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
zelly Posted February 15, 2013 Hey Jox, You really should make a concentrated effort to obtain a copy of Kaktusy 2005 Special # 2. In it the authors talk about the three (at that time) recognized species of Difusa and where they geographically occur. The good news is I believe it was Kadacuda who scanned the booklet & posted the images of the pages somewhere here. A pdf of those images/pages is 29837kb, probably too large to upload here. I believe , as Sally D says , L Koehresi was bred in Europe and is some sort of hybrid . Incorrect. L difusa var koehresii was classified to honor its discoverer, Mr. Gerhard Kohres, a renowned cactus seed trader. As a new taxon, it was discovered by Gerhard Kohres along with Professor Schreier in 1975. Page 20 in the booklet shows a geographical map of its distribution. here's a pic of my seed grown never grafted variegated koehresii I have also read that L.decipiens is a variety of L. williamsii. I categorize it as a difusa as it most closely resembles fricci in form & flower. Another question was about L.ziegleri, is this now called L.Diffusa? To my knowledge L ziegleri first appeared as a cultivar in a UK collection. In 2007 I obtained 5 tiny seedlings from a certain grower in UK. The single plant I have left looks much more like a williamsii than a difusa with defined ribs and pink flowers. Maybe I was sold mis-labeled plants. If i can recover a folder on a crashed HD, I'll post up pics of them & I may have the scanned UK Cactus Journal page where they first appeared in print. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bogfrog Posted February 15, 2013 Hey Jox, I have this kaktusy 2005 special # 2 as a PDF file. Cant remember where i got it as it was a couple of years ago but i will try send it you when i am next at a computer. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jox Posted February 16, 2013 Thanks guys , @ zelly, the plants I'm looking for names for come from you mate,so I will be taking your advice . I have been reading lots about them. When it come to Koehresii I have found the same information as you & was just trying to work out if it should be L. diffusa var koehresii or just L. koehresii? About Decipiens, the information I have found on this is very conflicting. For example Leon Croizats names it as L.williamsii var decipiens & Gerhard Kohres places it in the L.fricci complex? I think I might just leave the L.decipiens label for now . L.ziegleri??? This one I thought I had work out as I have found the same information on a lot of sites eg(Cactus Art, Vaults of Erowid, kakteen Forum, Mycotopia, Wiki & Cactuspedia.) Everything I can find says L. ziegleri (werdermann) is an out of date name & now a synonym of L. diffua. Dr Werdermann described it as having yellow/white flowers. Maybe you did get mis-labeled plants? Now I'm wondering what else it could be ?? I would love to see a photo of your plant & hear more about this one. Cheers jox Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Weazelloph Posted February 18, 2013 (edited) Sorry to jump in but ive done a fair bit of reading around on the loph species and have bought many different plants from all of the world. When purchasing a plant named L. Ziegleri I was forced by myself to ask the person for more information about this. I found so much conflitiing information and some just plain confusing pages, most agreeing with whats said above but when I recieved The message it was stating that it was a williamsii and that is just what it is named in his country.. (which by memory was poland) Ive come across this a few times so if anyone wants me to look into where I got them from or wants to see pictures ill be more Than happy to post a couple pics! Ps. From the nursery I go to the jourdania is a cultivate of the lophophora williamsii. Edited February 18, 2013 by Weazelloph 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
2Deep2Handle Posted February 26, 2013 Everything I can find says L. ziegleri (werdermann) is an out of date name & now a synonym of L. diffua. Dr Werdermann described it as having yellow/white flowers. What I knew to be true! L difusa var koehresii was classified to honor its discoverer, Mr. Gerhard Kohres, a renowned cactus seed trader. As a new taxon, it was discovered by Gerhard Kohres along with Professor Schreier in 1975. Zelly man, I always though it was straight L.koehresii ? Whats the go with difusa and koehresii in terms of fertility? Jox.....saw your alberto aquissition the other day. What a sight to behold. I'm coming for a visit to yours as soon as it arrives, so i may view it, and scar the image into my spank bank 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
zelly Posted February 26, 2013 2D2H- Click on the jpg above (page 20 of the Kaktusy Special #2 booklet). See where it says when the plant was first discovered, it was classified in the Difusa species. ? See where it says later on, it was elevated to a separate species. ? In terms of fertility, both seem to be self infertile. ps- You need pics for your spank bank?? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
