vual

OHS Act .vS The COPS!!?!

21 posts in this topic

Today a friend and myself were pulled over by the police for a "RBT", Happily following the police officer who was standing in the middle of the road's direction, my friend pulled over and blew into the tube, the check was negitive and then he was told to show his license so he did, after the police officer making some comments about the dates he then informed my friend that he was to have a drug test...

So long story short he tested positive to "they couldn't tell him, sending to lab".

(what do you expect music concert and new years eve this weekend 0_o)

So my question involves workplace health and safety...

In the QLD police manual i can find "refrence" to the following acts:

Police Powers and Responsibilities Act 2000

Public Safety Preservation Act 1986

Transport Operations (Road Use Management) Act 1995

Transport Operations (Road Use Management ­ Road Rules) Regulation 1999

Workplace Health and Safety Act 1995

But i cant find no were in black and white that they have to obey the acts, only reference as a guideline, do they have to obey Workplace Health and Safety Act 1995??

So the setup they had was 2 cars, 1 Testing duel cab ute, parked on the Footpath blocking the actual concreat path (blocking the entire walkway).

They had 0 traffic cones and 0 signs, and the guy waving down in the middle of the road was using his breath tester to wave everyone down with no traffic wand or "stop police" sign. This was all done on a quiet yet fairly busy back road.They did though have on reflective vest.

The reason i bring this up was i was recently stopped by "work place health and safety officer" for parking on a footpath, with traffic cones around and reflector vest on, but still i got threated with a $10,000 fine by him and had alot of drama simply because there was no "slow down to 40" sign.

So finaly the question:

was the officer technically on duty because he was not technically on a work site?..... or was he not on duty because he had no traffic cones.... OR is he exempt because he is "a Employee of the CROWN" ?

:( :(

Edited by vual

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No he is not exempt from the OHS acts we have a police man in Bundaberg who was given a fine for failure to comply after he wrote a fine for the OHS officer.

OHS : You have to be Kidding you're giving me a fine?

Occifer: the law is the law.

OHS takes fine and then asks For occifers name

Occifer: My name is S***** Why?

OHS I am giving you a fine for No Vest???

Occifer : You've got to be kidding?

OHS: The law is the law!

Guess who got the biogger fine? lol

But,

Did you take photographic evidence of the site? How does that help your mate? if he proves +ve he proves +ve?

I would be trying the Rogdog approach, lol

http://www.shaman-australis.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=23532&view=getlastpost

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I contemplated taken a photo then i remembered that its illegal to take a photo of crown stuff (like army bases, police bases... cop car...), and then what if the see me, they could beat me to the ground calling me a terrorist.... fuck the world its a joke.

Oh ya if he testes + he testes +, but if the police were not in there jurisdiction to test then obviously the test would be void in court..

And if the police were not using "Traffic Cones" then they were in Breach of there Obligation to the Act (OHS) and therefor are not "on Duty".

But its all pretty dam pointless, ya i been well aware of the freeman movement for a while, but are you really going to turn to the cop and say "MR BLAH BLAH isn't my name i am Blah of the blah family and i am not giving you my license for i do not contract with your organization...... ".

Nice in theory ... common law i mean...

Edited by vual

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I hear you! I was actually referring to the court side of things though.If you can show you are not a person/company etc as rogdog says he has in thread linked above, then how can they have any control over what substance you put into your body..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@dwork - that ticket thing between the OHS and cop is an old myth that has made the rounds for years. The only difference is the name of the place is different.

A policeman can pretty much ignore any law they want to if they are carrying out their duties. An example would be chasing a speeding driver, they can also speed to effect an arrest. They have to obey Workplace Health and Safety Act but they can get around it as they are carrying out duties as a police officer. There are lots of grey areas were they could get into trouble but the brotherhood will stick together.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I hear you! I was actually referring to the court side of things though.If you can show you are not a person/company etc as rogdog says he has in thread linked above, then how can they have any control over what substance you put into your body..

hold your horses there bro!...rogdog says???? I never said nothing about whatever the fuck your talking about...

SWIM would have drove str8 threw the porcine obstacle

send a ham to the kids ;(

[edit] I've got some family who is ex cops, and they are great people...just folks doing thier job...

all the cops do is bring up charges to a magistrates court. (after thier supervisors approve it)..it's up to you if you accept or contest or ignore the charge.

Don't run over any pigs because of what I said please

Edited by rogdog

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@dwork - that ticket thing between the OHS and cop is an old myth that has made the rounds for years. The only difference is the name of the place is different.

A policeman can pretty much ignore any law they want to if they are carrying out their duties. An example would be chasing a speeding driver, they can also speed to effect an arrest. They have to obey Workplace Health and Safety Act but they can get around it as they are carrying out duties as a police officer. There are lots of grey areas were they could get into trouble but the brotherhood will stick together.

Better to say nothing than prove your ignorance.

A policeperson cannot ignore any law fullstop. They have a few leeways with speeding, because of the advanced driving classes they take, but otherwise, their job is to bring peeps who break the law before a court......somewhere along the line, they (police) have been roped into enforcing legislation...thats where the problem is. Don't get me wrong, I have no love for police, but they are duped as much as the rest of us

If cops enforced the law, and not legislation, life would be good...

3 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

most council trucks don't carry 40 signs :blink: why does traffic need to slow down to 40 because your vehicle is on the footpath? not really the topic, just sayin'. there are actually a whole heap of rules about traffic signage but i would have thought the real issue would have been did you leave a safe path that pedestrians could use? in some cases that can mean putting up those heavy plastic barriers.

ummm anyway don't quote me, but i think you'll find roadside workers quite regularly don't use cones or signs, nor is it a strict requirement, where back streets are concerned. it's more a case that the employer doesn't want their workers getting hurt and the workers (and their employer) don't want blood on their hands, its all helpful in court if something goes wrong. have you never seen a big truck using a driveway, and some guy in a vest just stands on the road signalling traffic to wait?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

hold your horses there bro!...rogdog says???? I never said nothing about whatever the fuck your talking about...

SWIM would have drove str8 threw the porcine obstacle

send a ham to the kids ;(

[edit] I've got some family who is ex cops, and they are great people...just folks doing thier job...

all the cops do is bring up charges to a magistrates court. (after thier supervisors approve it)..it's up to you if you accept or contest or ignore the charge.

Don't run over any pigs because of what I said please

http://www.shaman-australis.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=23532&view=findpost&p=283445

Mate, my comment is in reference to your posts uf letters sent to the courts which is basicallly telling them they haven't any authority over you [flesh& blood man] and I am saying if someone can do that they are also showing they can't stop you from putting anything you like into your system. It wasn't a slight about you, nor your posts.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

OHS : You have to be Kidding you're giving me a fine?

Occifer: the law is the law.

OHS takes fine and then asks For occifers name

Occifer: My name is S***** Why?

OHS I am giving you a fine for No Vest???

Occifer : You've got to be kidding?

OHS: The law is the law!

i believe this is an urban legend.

cops dont have to wear vests as they r instantly a highly visible target if they pull some guy over and he jumps out with a gun. I have heard the same story repeated for most states and major citys in Australia.

ur friend just may have to suck it up, pay the fine or do the time, or get a VERY good lawyer and set a precedent.

i really believe on festival dates and other big events where its common knowledge people are gonna get munted on dwugs, u need a designated driver who has been clean for the last 24 hours.

i got swabbed TWICE the weekend of the bathurst car races. thank jebus i was clean.

apparently the testing machine will only register erb if u have toked in the last 24 hours (from the sargeants mouth).

i dunno i can see where they are coming from. less munted drivers on the road cant be a bad thing.

cops are tops :P

i really want one of those stickers now for the back of my car!! where could u get one from???

Edited by incognito

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Maybe its just a story, the person that told me is a story teller, but everyone that knows this officer says the same story about him, he also booked his own mum, I bet Hutch knows who I am talking about [motor cycle cop], he also parked his bike on the edge to book someone and it fell down the embankment he asked for help to get his bike up and got laughed at.. I wont put his name up though call me paranoidm, I am... They might just be doing their job but I think they get a kick out of it- the job attracts a certain type of person??

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

i think u have good and bad people wherever u go and in every profession.

im sure the police force has its share of cocksuckers, as would say, the floristry industry.

however I know for a fact that there are some very decent people who are police officers, who have a genuine concern for their communities. To be honest i take my hat of to them. Shift work, the money aint the greatest, and the amount of shit that u would cop and stress u would have to live with.. screw that!!

having been a heavy drug user in the past, i know how shithouse of a driver i was under the influence.

munted on ganja I have had a few near misses in busy city traffic, which if i am being honest, would be because i was so stoned. Only car accident ive had was when i was 19 choka blok full of pingers, i was talking shit to my gf in the passenger seat with te stereo full blast not even watching the road, at the time i dont even think i knew i was driving i was so locked into the convo. BAM straight up the ass of a brand new beamer in neutral bay. Spent the next 3 yrs payin for the guys panel beating job.

Moral of the story is (IMO), ur kidding urself if u think dwugs dont affect ur driving.If Having a testing station to test peeps who are driving under the influence reduces the road death toll, thats bonzer in my books.

Im unsure if it tests for prescription meds? Im sure having a quantum amount of benzos in ur system cant be that good for ur driving capabilitys.

personally im glad we have cops. To be honest im lucky enough not to have met an asshole cop.Touch wood!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I got pulled over for speeding (which was fair enough) 20k over the limit on a roadworks section of highway a couple of years ago in the rain (I was alert, straight, and the car more than capable of handling conditions but I still agree fair enough warranting a ticket) and the cop did a U-ey over double lanes in holiday traffic and made me pull over (right up my arse, was in no way going to wait for me to find a more suitable spot) onto a very narrow edge of road piece which dropped to an embankment. I pulled over as far as I dared yet the copper parked with around a third of the arse of his car on the single lane road. I thought that logically my speeding - and I was in no way tailgating or breaking the law in any other way - was far less dangerous than how he'd parked his car to book me. He also didn't have a safety vest on which would've been required in the rain and he'd had ample time to put one on before getting out because he would've seen I'd turned the engine off.

I have no qualms with cops handing out tickets for those who break the law; it's their job. But I do think there should be an equal or greater accountability for themselves to make sure they're also doing the right thing. For what it's worth, I had no other beef with the dude; he was courteous and in no way arrogant or powerhungry-seeming. But being nice doesn't excuse a potential accident from someone accidentally slamming into the back of his car which would've hit mine.

Edit: yeah I'm also curious on what goes with prescription drugs and what constitutes "reckless driving". If I were loaded up with RX'd oxycodone during the height of my codeine abuse but I was in no way "intoxicated" or otherwise adversely affected by it, would it be a relatively easy thing to get off on a charge for causing an accident by say, just not keeping a big enough gap between the car in front and it was a minor bingle, yet if my opioid levels were extraordinarily high (as needed with a high opiate tolerance) normally that would have an extra charge on top of the tailgaiting charge. Would I simply end up being charged for the tailgating and not the extra DUI (narcotics)?

Edited by FancyPants

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

most council trucks don't carry 40 signs :blink: why does traffic need to slow down to 40 because your vehicle is on the footpath? not really the topic, just sayin'. there are actually a whole heap of rules about traffic signage but i would have thought the real issue would have been did you leave a safe path that pedestrians could use? in some cases that can mean putting up those heavy plastic barriers.

ummm anyway don't quote me, but i think you'll find roadside workers quite regularly don't use cones or signs, nor is it a strict requirement, where back streets are concerned. it's more a case that the employer doesn't want their workers getting hurt and the workers (and their employer) don't want blood on their hands, its all helpful in court if something goes wrong. have you never seen a big truck using a driveway, and some guy in a vest just stands on the road signalling traffic to wait?

Yes and they are playing a dangerous game, mostly due to lazyness me myself... lets just say "I "know" someone who works for the council, and that someone could be me"...

so ya i am aware of how its "ment" to be and i am also aware of how they "do" it, see the thing about backstreets is theres a low chance for a OHS to drive past then on a main road, i myself was booked on a backstreet due to following the same mentality as most my co-workers, but once i was forced by the officer to do the short course i learned the legislation about working beside roads. And you are right it is due to not leaving a path, but did you know to errect those barriers one must first get a special goverment permit on that road and that could take a week+ .

The rules you are referring to are all learned in traffic control course 1 and 2, then theres the "working beside roads" course that every "supervisor" should have.

Just annoys the shit outa me, its all read tape and bullshit, sometimes i have to use sinage and sometimes the job just needs to be done fast so we wont, but even then we risk a OHS officer to fine us, like mentioned its already happend to me for the same reasons :(.. its just like Russian Roulet.

So what rdogg would do is, drive threw the check point, and once he gets the letter in the mail he would reply with some legal wizardy Turing it around onto them?

or would he pull over and say " I dont consent to your breath test, i am born solverign land owner of this land, you are standing on my road, you work for a company with a abn and im not going to contract with you" .... ?

Sorry rdogg you are now the poster boy for common law and freemanism (is that a word... is now!! I COINED IT!!) ^_^

I just dont have the balls for that especially when the cops make you pull over to a side street and get all up in your face and snatch your wallet form your hand etc... its asking to be hurt.

Might have to set up secret cameras in the car so i can try it out, i bet theres a law against that to, probably makes me a terrorist.

incognito, drugs do affect driving, by taken drugs 3 days earlier doesn't (unless u have a bad acid flash back...) (drug was on new years eve, still in system form that 3 days later)... :(

i know plenty of people who eat valium like lollies and drive around, i wonder if they would be booked?

Also imo i would dare say a relaxed stoner who is driving always under the speed limit and is checking everywhere due to paranoia, would be a better driver then a angry middle age man trying to make his way home from work on a late day, each to there own some would disagree.

IMO the moral of the story is, This is my fake dream reality so take your roads and fuck off or the government can start paying me rent for them....

I know some nice cops to, family members, still when the time comes, should they be shown mercy, consider the "good" ones martyrs if you will....

Incognito you are a women you will never meet a asshole cop, they don't feel threated by you, and i am sure you do exactly what they say when they say it, not to mention other obvious body differences.

Serious Question Time:

Can one put a police officer under citizen arrest, and what do you think would happen if they delivered him to the station persionaly in hand cuffs?

....Crap now the entire topic has moved onto should police exist or not, its started as a simple non political "do they have to follow the OHS act"......

(and yes the story has done the rounds here to but instead of a Vest it was his Hat)

Edited by vual

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I asked someone who knows this cop today if it was true, and he said it was definitely a true story, and he got it straight from the cop himself, obviously the staes apply regs differently but they all have a duty of care for their own and others safety. He obviously failed on that account on this day..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

http://www.shaman-au...ndpost&p=283445

Mate, my comment is in reference to your posts uf letters sent to the courts which is basicallly telling them they haven't any authority over you [flesh& blood man] and I am saying if someone can do that they are also showing they can't stop you from putting anything you like into your system. It wasn't a slight about you, nor your posts.

yes, sorry mate, I was on the turps when I posted that, and was thinking about an occasion the popo had abused my rights. I meant no offense to you

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Incognito you are a women you will never meet a asshole cop, they don't feel threated by you, and i am sure you do exactly what they say when they say it, not to mention other obvious body differences.

chauvanistic pig!! i slap thee :slap:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Maybe its just a story, the person that told me is a story teller, but everyone that knows this officer says the same story about him, he also booked his own mum, I bet Hutch knows who I am talking about [motor cycle cop], he also parked his bike on the edge to book someone and it fell down the embankment he asked for help to get his bike up and got laughed at.. I wont put his name up though call me paranoidm, I am... They might just be doing their job but I think they get a kick out of it- the job attracts a certain type of person??

This gave me some lolz, I know some ex motorcycle cops, and the stories they tell are hilarious, apart from the abusing everybodies rights part, but the shit they see is amazing. And for sure, if you give them any attitude, you wil probably get your car put over the pits for a full roadworthy test.

it's bullshit, and we need to find a way around it

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We all know modern Law is Contract Law. Contract law states that both parties must be made aware of the conditions of Contract [bi-lateral contract] otherwise it is a uni-lateral contract and it is not valid. I think the best thing I have seen so far is the Refusal for cause- No Contract. I have had success using it, and I have read of other successes south of here on the motorways [tolls] Railways [no ticket] etc I cant find the website that was talking about it and I have really looked. I find a lot of the good activist freeman sites are being shutdown within a couple of months. The website I found this info on was haunted by someone posting as Peter LAlor and he is seen at a lot of them just bagging out peoples ideas on how to beat the system - perhaps he's a Fed seeing which sites have the goods. Anyway if you get fined or sent a bill etc - the Refusal for cause has been used successfully....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Incognito is my favourite female member of sab. Right after that japanese girl teotz! :P

Oh yeah freeman on the land doesn't work. I should know, I'm a cop!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Incognito is my favourite female member of sab. Right after that japanese girl teotz! :P

Oh yeah freeman on the land doesn't work. I should know, I'm a cop!

If you are a cop you have no authority to tell us uit does not work - you are bluffing cos youi's are scared the people are waking up to your fraud, lol.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now