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santiago

9/11: Phone calls from the towers

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I know a few members are interested in this kinda stuff, on channel ABC1 830pm tonight.

The above title is the name of the show and i think it will make harrowing viewing.

Discussion on this topic has been repeated before so i doubt anything else will be answered diferently.

So there you go, hope i helped you decide what tv to watch tonight. The Twin Towers, arguably the most defining human moment in history for good and bad.

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The Twin Towers, arguably the most defining human moment in history for good and bad.

I'd like to hear that argument made :devil:

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I know a few members are interested in this kinda stuff, on channel ABC1 830pm tonight.

The above title is the name of the show and i think it will make harrowing viewing.

Discussion on this topic has been repeated before so i doubt anything else will be answered diferently.

So there you go, hope i helped you decide what tv to watch tonight. The Twin Towers, arguably the most defining human moment in history for good and bad.

I'm not really interested in ''IT''... but id say a few of us here are compelled to try and awaken others as much as ''they'' would love to remain in teh dark for whatever reason... its not really a obsession more of a responsiblty to at least try , responsible truth sharers yeah! ..its not like yall gonna hear it on any main steam media outlet , including triple J news ... oh well back to grazing baaa baaa........

35967_111204235601150_100001347235115_81412_5541326_n.jpg

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it seems so strange to me that although no reason can be pinned down *moxuxsxsxaxd*, some people still believe the official line and keep those liars in power because of this. The official story is just so completely ridiculous that it just boggles my mind how people can go along with it.

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I reckon it was fucked up on purpose , the whole time, for how many years? and all folk can do is discuss whether or whether not a freakin plane hit the building? meanwhile they be doin all sorts of shit.... everyone too busy being left or right ... to me is no question, but fuck! what about the shit goin down right nao?

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racketemensch im not making an arument its merely a statement, probably how its a defining moment in security and general warfare which subjugates the mind of the masses in a global realm never seen before in predictable future, people died for some unforseable cause which is undescribable for most humans, something touching on that.......i see it as a turning point, to what that will end up being who knows, hiroshima was worse than twin towers, if you could possibly imagine seeing mushroom clouds evaporate 100000 people on primetime TV we well may be talking about that now, but were not.............and were not talking about gallipoli or many of the innumerate battle which have occured throughout history either are we, just because you feel you have some mainsteam view of the pretty picture the world should be in your current eyes well then thats just the way you interpret modern life, which is all it comes down to...........you have life and you interpret it the way in which endevours your own personal cause.

did 100000 ppl die in hiroshima for the greater good of humanity, did the twin towers fall via a unforseen event the human race will always remember, in 1000 years time will the greater good of humanity visit such a tragic event and view it a a danger sign...we may never know, thats just my responce provocation of a verbal argument.

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false flag lol

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Yeah it might've been a little provocative of me to bait you to make an argument that is a reflection of popular belief, and which may have little to do with your own beliefs. It seems as though viewing 11/09 as some kind of historical upheaval and cataclysmic turning point is thoroughly media constructed and has much to do with a very old school style of history, namely empire-building.

The event in itself has never struck me as all that horrific in comparison with the daily horrors lived out by vast numbers of people in the world, with epidemics like AIDS and authoritarian regimes, with historical and ongoing colonialism and so on. The interesting marker of this event, as blowng hinted at, is that it was a fantastic smokescreen (pun intended?) for numerous other goings-on that are no doubt making the world a happier, safer place for all.

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Yeah it might've been a little provocative of me to bait you to make an argument that is a reflection of popular belief, and which may have little to do with your own beliefs. It seems as though viewing 11/09 as some kind of historical upheaval and cataclysmic turning point is thoroughly media constructed and has much to do with a very old school style of history, namely empire-building.

The event in itself has never struck me as all that horrific in comparison with the daily horrors lived out by vast numbers of people in the world, with epidemics like AIDS and authoritarian regimes, with historical and ongoing colonialism and so on. The interesting marker of this event, as blowng hinted at, is that it was a fantastic smokescreen (pun intended?) for numerous other goings-on that are no doubt making the world a happier, safer place for all.

Although that is simplifying I agree, when it's put like that you can see how powerful and dangerous the media really is. As Mckenna said "If you go to Bosnia or Somalia or Peru or much of the third-world then it appears that the apocalypse has already arrived.” To people looking at things objectively it is more of the same. I'm sure people thought WW2 would be the most defining moment in human history at the time. That being said, the fact that in recent history, 2 planes got flown into the twin towers in broad day, New York as part of a false flag event constructed by our corrupt leaders to forward their agenda is something we should make a turning point if anything.

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You guys give the US administration and its agencies way too much credit! People can't seem to get their heads around the idea that a lone person (Oswald) or a relatively small group of people (911 Jihadists), all of who have real motive and evidence against them, can create a major catastrophe with minimal resources. 9/11 was not a false flag event. It was an event that was poorly investigated and acted upon prior to it happening and The US administration (and particularly Donald Rumsfeld and the CIA's George Tenet) certainly used it as an argument for going to war with Iraq and procuring additional funds for security, intelligence and defence. Ultimately 9/11 was a BIG event because America made it a big event and the extremists were acutely aware of this and wanted the US economy to spend up big - that's what americans do - they make big movies, big cars, eat big portions of food, live in big houses. There's plenty of people around the world that are pissed off about that. Americans cry when they loose and they need a big stars and stripes flag to wipe away their big patriotic tears. They still think they are fighting superpowers and can't see the little termites eating away their wooden house. They need to show constant imagery of big firefighters, big police and big booted military adventures with big equipment and big faith. Deep down I think both the official media and the conspiracy media hate the fact they had their archilles tendon slashed while showing off their apple pie biceps. David and Goliath.

The underlying theme I see in 9/11 is how America thought it was so immune to this sort of thing. America is the school bully who didnt realise the consequences of taking the arabs and asian kids lunch money. The action of the Jihadists is a master-stroke because they bit the hand that feeds them - and as a trump card people then go on and believe it was their own government or some satanic knights templar royal bloodline thing that did it!! I think a lot of American leaders and media googling folk in general love the conspiracy theories because it continues the illusion of their culture being all big, supreme and powerful - this supposed super 'illuminati'. Allowing and fuelling conspiracy theories about an inside job helps deflect attention away from all the bad decisions made along the way. The Jihadists succeeded because they dont have any of that rubbish. They have nothing left except blind faith. They had a motive and the means to do it and they pulled it off. For most people extremists living in caves in Afghanistan may aswell be living on Mars - there's not much there to pull apart or relate to so people start interpretting all the footage and comments from political figures in the news as a way of dealing with the issue. Conspiracy theorists see the huge market there and capitalize upon it. If America had done 9/11 it's more than likely they would have bungled it up with all their different factions angling for power, fame and money. Sorry rant over, flame away

Edited by botanika

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It's not conspiracy theorist, it's citizens and scientist.

There's a good doco by citizen investigation team (here) which debunks the story completely with indisputable facts from many eyewitnesses. There is so much evdence of a controlled demolition, including scientific papers (here) describing the discovery of nano-thermite which is made only in american miltary labs, not by jihadist.

Building 7 was not hit and has strong evidence of a controlled demolition as with the two towers, they were in free fall which is not possible in a normal pancake collapse even if you neglect the fact that it was the first steel building to collapse from fire. A lot of Engineers who want a new investigation and explain these ideas here: Architects & Engineers for 9/11 Truth.

They have heaps of awesome videos, including an ad that was aired an new york as many ppl are unaware of building seven.

"Building What" Familily members who lost loved ones speak in this.

The underlying theme I see in 9/11 is how America thought it was so immune to this sort of thing.

Why cant you see it was a false flag and the air force was stood down, you've heard this so why do you clutch to the ridiculous fantasy.

Edited by ref1ect1ons

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If it wasn't a conspiracy I don't know what you'd call it.

It would have to be the most uncanny series of coincidences in the history of the world, NORAD was stood down and the US military was doing exercises involving hypothetical hijacked planes flying into the pentagon and the WTC on 911.

NORAD stood down on 911

By the way there is no organisation called Al-qaeda, Al-qeada is the name of a database of mujaheddin used to do the CIA's dirty work all around the world. This is public knowledge that never sees the light of day or gets any media coverage.

That in itself is conspiracy - the media presenting lies and now it's been established as fact in the minds of the sheeple.

Alqeada - the database

But the media wouldn't lie to us would they ?

And by the way Kennedy was assassinated soon after he signed executive order 11110 and tried to put the U.S. federal reserve (which is a private company) out of business.Executive order 11110

He was also shot several times from different angles, even if Oswald did shoot him someone else did too. Is that proof of a conspiracy or another outlandish coincidence?

Edited by Magicdirt
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Building 7 was not hit and has strong evidence of a controlled demolition as with the two towers, they were in free fall which is not possible in a normal pancake collapse even if you neglect the fact that it was the first steel building to collapse from fire. A lot of Engineers who want a new investigation and explain these ideas here: Architects & Engineers for 9/11 Truth.

Why cant you see it was a false flag and the air force was stood down, you've heard this so why do you clutch to the ridiculous fantasy.

Everything is rediculous fantasy until hard evidence is provided. There is no conclusive evidence of a controlled demolition and even if we speculate the trade centers had demolitions installed it does not conclusively prove a false flag operation but could point to something else, seldomly discussed, like demolitions being placed in the building after the 1993 bombing as an emergency measure to ensure the buildings collapse without damaging surrounding civic infrastructure or people. Norad initially standing down does not prove it was flase flag either. It could be any number of things including for example poor decision making, confusion and incompetency. But again there is no hard evidence. You have all these people saying 'well it looks like a controlled demolition, so it must be'...'well that guy said he saw molten steel at ther base - so it must be true'...'this guy has a degree in engineering...I guess he must be right'. Norad didnt completely stand down either - they scrambled jets to shoot down flight 93. Now one can debate whether they did indeed shoot it down or whether the plane crashed just before they reached it, as they officially claimed, but it still does not imply the whole of 911 was an inside job. There are certainly a lot of unanswered questions regarding 911, a lot of information and evidence we will never see and certainly a lot of media and political manipulation but coincidence and naked speculation does not equal hard proof.

He was also shot several times from different angles, even if Oswald did shoot him someone else did too. Is that proof of a conspiracy or another outlandish coincidence?

Again evidence does not support this. You can believe Oliver Stone if you like but your wasting your time. Oswald had motive and had a whole string of evidence against him. It was his Mannlicher-Carcano rifle. That's pretty heavy by itself. Oswald was the only employee at the Book Depository Building who fled the building after the assassination. Forty-five minutes later, he shoots and kills Officer J. D. Tippit, Dallas Police Department. That murder bore the signature of a man in desperate flight from some awful deed. Thirty minutes later at a Texas theatre he resists arrest, pulls a gun on the arresting officer. During his interrogation, Oswald told one provable lie after another, showing a consciousness of guilt. He didn't need to be an expert shot to fire off those rounds, he just needed to be a good shot, and that is exactly what Oswald was - he was a good trained marksmen. The Zapruder film 'looks' like the head flies back from a bullet from the grassy knoll but is in fact nerve damage - his back muscles tightening and recoiling back as his his head was blown apart from Oswalds bullet from the rear. Dont believe me? Go watch the film frame by frame. At frame 312, the president’s head is okay. At frame 313, which is 1/18 of a second later, you see the president struck in the head, the explosion to the head. (There are 18.3 frames per second in the Zapruder film.) In frame 313, the President’s head is not pushed backwards but it’s pushed slightly forward, 2.3 inches forward, indicating a shot from the rear, where Oswald was. This all-important moment of impact is much more important than what you see on the film: [in frame 313] the president’s head is pushed forward, indicating a shot from the rear. Also, a high-contrast photo of frame 313 shows this terrible spray of blood and tissue all to the front, indicating a shot from the rear. The subsequent frames gives the illusion of a forwad shot as his body contracts back from nerve damage and the cars forward inertia. There is no magic bullet. Conally was seated to JFK’s left front, in a jump seat a half-foot in, so the orientation of Connally’s body with Kennedy’s was such that a bullet passing on a straight line, through Kennedy, would have no where else to go, except to hit Governor Connally. There is no conclusive evidence of a second gunman because there wasn't a second gunman. The Warren Commission's written record has been consistently distorted and the whole case intentionally shrouded in misinformation. The Kennedy family agreed with the Warren Commission findings. There's a huge cottage industry surrounding JFK and conspiracies in general. Im sure you can understand why certain people want to continue distorting the truth. It makes them a great deal of money.

Edited by botanika

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I suppose the fact that there were "exercises" going on the day of the London bombings involving simultaneous bombs going off at the exact places where the real bombs went off that day was just another coincidence.

London bombings exercises

It's easy to hold on to your beliefs especially when they are "safe" ones.

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i dont believe in conspiricy theories at all and if i start to even entertain the thought i like to refer back to my favourite dictionary and my favourite dictionary contains this

http://skepdic.com/911conspiracy.html

also i would like to add the two following vids of the same thing but different noises

the first one is the real sound of the tower falling

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=CGzpJYtLqiA

the second one is the popular super imposing of explosion noises so the so called demolition could be heard

http://www.youtube.c...feature=related

these two vids above are not the originals, they are still though versions of the same thing, the tower falling vids created huge discussion years ago especially when the second one with the explosion sounds was proven to be a fraud, i suppose it demonstrates how desperate conspiricy theorists are to prove something which doesnt exist. its almost delusional.

Edited by santiago

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i suppose it demonstrates how desperate conspiricy theorists are to prove something which doesnt exist. its almost delusional.

I suppose it demonstrates how effective disinformation agents are with their cunning tricks to discredit real evidence by mixing it with bullshit.

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There was a guy (Gregg Braden?) saying that after 9/11 (or 11/9 in Australia..) there was some kind of spike in the magnetic field of the Earth. I'm pretty vague on the details, but his theory was something like our emotional output (in that case overwhelmingly negative) caused those measurable changes in the magnetic field. I think he goes much deeper than that, but even that concept is quite interesting.

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^^^

Think about it, horrific images on repeat that tell us our sense of democracy, freedom and security are under attack. Broadcast on repeat for about 2 weeks non stop all around the world. Psyops are effective but pretty simple to figure out. A lie repeated becomes the truth.

Also I'm sure the Gaza flotilla had agent provocateurs on board that sparked the violence (apart from the aggression of the commandos), what does this say? That all your best efforts at peace will be trampled by the unstoppable force of evil. Like Kennedy actings as a reminder that resistance is futile.

Either be scared of the terrorists, or be filled with angst cuz ye know too much.. ye know too much!

I reckon that being too informed without having the inner strength is a scary thing. The further you read into this it becomes a little bit overwhelming. I guess that's why many just ignore conspiracy theories, a sanity safety mechanism cuz this is scary shit! If our state of mind has got that much of an effect I rather not be complicit but I already know too much, time to crank the good vibes.

Edited by The Dude
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AE911truth.org

Orchestrated litany of lies, someone phrased once...

Engineers can see that the claims don't add up with respect to physics and chemistry. There's also a pilots for 911 truth because the claims made with respect to the flying in those types of aircraft is impossible. Maybe the real criminals responsible think when the economy collapses, people will take their minds off the 911 lies.

:(

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^^^

Either be scared of the terrorists, or be filled with angst cuz ye know too much.. ye know too much!

I reckon that being too informed without having the inner strength is a scary thing. The further you read into this it becomes a little bit overwhelming. I guess that's why many just ignore conspiracy theories, a sanity safety mechanism cuz this is scary shit! If our state of mind has got that much of an effect I rather not be complicit but I already know too much, time to crank the good vibes.

Fear is one of the most basic methods of mind control, when you are scared or in fear you're off your game. It's the preferred method of tyrants all over the world.

Fear is not a disease of the body; fear kills the soul.

Ghandi

:wave-finger: fuck those bastards they can go and scare a few kittens or puppies, I'll decide how I feel - not them.

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Maybe if more people like this come forward people would start listening , i know alot are already...

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=g6qtGzRkK6o

edit* Wow I just watched the vid in this link below, looks like there are more people that know somethings up than the mainstream, zionist media lets on. Shits about to get real!

http://www.presstv.ir/detail/143885.html

Edited by blowng

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It's easy to hold on to your beliefs especially when they are "safe" ones.

It's about proving facts. If you are going to bring belief systems into it I'm sure you must recognise the consistent and provable suicide bombing and martydom behavior of many extremist groups. You must also recognise the somewhat sad American belief that they are going to be a John Wayne superpower forever - the eternal frontier - and go to heaven with a burger in their hand. Any group of people will have profiteers, manipulators or controlers and conspiracy theorists are not exempt from this. No one on here is discussing the islamic side of the story. Most of us here are australians and we should know better. Most conspiracy theorists don't understand the complexity of Islamic fundamentalism and perhaps they are not even interested because its far easier and lucrative to take on the domestic pro christian market hungry to slurp up theories about a president they are embarassed by and the american dream of wealth they will never be part of. Conspiracy theories are rarely about provable facts but bringing comfort and a false sense of knowledge empowerment to the masses of gullable people who can't understand that someone can fly a plane into a building or shoot a president with a $10 rifle.

I know a lot of people on here like to support the arguments of conspiracy theories so I'm not exactly taking the 'safe one' here :) Conspiracy movies and literature are chock full of mind controlling and suggestive mechanisms - that's exactly why people on this thread and all over the internet keep re-hashing the same old hollow arguments. 'Fear', 'secrets', 'iluuminati' etc...its no wonder why Dan Brown has become a very rich man.

I watch, read and enjoy conspiracy stuff just like anyone else - it's quite often good entertainment, there's no denying much of it is very cleverly done, but whether all the facts presented are true or not is another issue entirely.

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edit* Wow I just watched the vid in this link below, looks like there are more people that know somethings up than the mainstream, zionist media lets on. Shits about to get real!

http://www.presstv.i...ail/143885.html

Ahmadinejad makes a good point in that video, even if the American government's position on Sept. 11th is correct (i.e. it was done by Middle Eastern terrorists with no assistance from any part of the U.S. government), how does that justify the forceful occupation of Iraq and Afghanistan for around 10 years (and most likely Iran at some point)? I remember watching the news unfold in the months after Sept. 11th, Bush said America had a "quiet, unyielding anger". They started off bombing Afghanistan, supposedly to get Bin Laden, then somehow that went on to "Shock and Awe" in Iraq, and it skipped over to getting Sadam Hussein (for ostensibly humanitarian reasons), and the whole thing now seems to be to "bring democracy and peace to the Middle East" (Ministry of Peace??). I don't know how many people have been killed or injured, or how many families have been destroyed in the past 10 years (both in the Middle East and America + supporting nations), but the fact that Sept. 11th was used as justification for nearly a decade of war is simply wrong, regardless of who carried it out.

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