LIAN ZI XIAN (Nelumbo nucifera) image heavy work in progress

[Rev]

LIAN ZI XIAN

[ 20. August 2004, 04:47: Message edited by: reville ]

[Guest electro]

very nice find ...

its good to see some chem id in there aswell ... the "we are unsure what causes the activity" on sab site was disturbing to say the least ...

where did these come from ?

[Rev]

weeeelll

Im pretty wasted right now

too dbad im not entirely sure why

I brewed up 10g of corydalis last night and had 3/4 of it and it was how i remmebered it. Similar to Kratom

This morning i chugged down the last of it and felt the same again. But was OK

Then this afternokn my partner felt liek a Vodka and coke so i had one too except i threw in a desertspoon of Lotus hearts in mine

1/2 and hour later im giddy euphoric,neck feels floppy and ive got these warm tingles going around my spine. Its euphoric 'wooziness' with a stupid grin and intermittent giggles. Not bad :D

problem is i dont know if its the alcohol lotsu combo, the lotus corydalis combo or the corydalis alcohol or all 3!

But i know its something because corydalis doesnt do this, 60ml vodka doesnt do this, and i smoked some lotus hearts when i got them and got zero noticeable effect

[gerbil]

hey good find rev,

thanks for the info

Are those lotus plumules from an australian supplier? I'd be keen to get hold of some if you don't mind sharing the details.

Various lotus info in this pdf, more about export, but still little bits there

http://www.rirdc.gov.au/reports/AFO/01-032.pdf

[ 20. August 2004, 21:34: Message edited by: gerbil ]

[Rev]

yeah i got them sort of locally.. Adelaide

Now i have the packet im sure i can track more down, the woman said they are easy to get.

My advice is to go wherever in your capital city its is that there are a lot of Chinese businesses around and start looking for a herbalist. Not the slick ones but teh ones that have shelves piled high with real herbs

there will he heaps of ones worth getting. If converstaion is difficult ask the for a book and they usually have one with the english or latin name alongside teh chinese one

I also quite like Ban bian lian - Lobelia sinensis as a smoke with a real hit (lobeline). I used to smoke it when cigarettes made me congested. Lobelia smoke really opens up the airways

Herbs are usually cheap and come in lots of 1 jin (600g)

some you cant get or shouldnt ask for - like Chan su (Bufo venom) or nowadays Ma Huang (ephedra) (used to be $12/600g, they still use it but its not good to ask for it for many reasons including thought for their patients needing the hard to procure herb)

but many you can for medicine and enjoyment - I like it to overlap Corydalis for example gives a really nice buzz and well within medical doses and theres absolutley nothing better ive found for deep muscle/joint pain

some herbs are amusing. Hemp seed is used for constipation. The seeds must be treated as the ones i saw germinated en masse then died en masse. They were amongst the fattest healthiest looking hemp seeds ive ever seen too

Ill leave it a few days and try again this time with no corydalis.

whatever happened this afternoon was way beyond placebo - lets hope its the Lotus

[ 20. August 2004, 21:55: Message edited by: reville ]

[Felix]

Have tried this a few times as a tea, and soaked in wine. ZIP, even with large amounts.

Tried again a few hours ago with an old batch, heaped tablespoon, crushed and steeped in warm vodka. Extremely bitter but no effects.

Maybe there is some sort of synergy with corydalis....

[ 20. August 2004, 22:49: Message edited by: Felix ]

[Guest electro]

the effects described are what i get from sab lotus soaked for 1month in 60% + alcohol & drunk as shots followed by lemon

(lick sip suck without the salt & with the broth as tequila- i find the flavour similar with the perfumy aftertaste being the dead giveaway that it is lotus).

i wonder if "lotus paste" made from lotus seed is active ... it is used in SO much ... there are lots of pasteries filled with the stuf .. it tastes divine, but im sure i has a whole bunch of sugar in it (no good for low carb diets lol) ..

i am SO going to parramatta soon to check out the grocers & herbalists ... failing that its to china town & failing that im going to cabramatta !

so many wonderful places full of lovely food and delightful herbs !

[puffinstuf87]

what is meant by radicle of seed? and lotus heart? is the the embryo? also, what part of the plant is the photograph at the top of?

[planthelper]

http://tcm.health-info.org/Herbology.Mater...-properties.htm

[Rev]

The bit up top is the germ. The bit that becomes the root and first leaf

Its is separated from the endosperm which is the bit eaten as lotus seed paste

I didnt notice any perfumy aroma - only a distinct bitterness

[NatureBoy]

any ideas as to whether the chemicals here would be similar to Nymphaea? (blue lotus)

[dertwerver]

Nymphae carulea - blue form is what we use. pick fresh whole flowers mid-morning with a small section of petiole attached cut bud/ovary in half & soak 24 hours in your fav red wine, strain & consume. it seems to synergize & produce a very noticieable effect which calms & quietens the mind. i was very suprised at the level of effect from 2 glasses of red which lasted well into the following afternoon. four others at various times all reported consistient effects.

[hebrew]

would you treat the hearts the same as lotus flowers? i mean soaking in alcohol for a period of time.

this post inspired me so i went and bought some from a local TCM. Also got some Corydalis, Ephedra, lobelia.

thanks

hebrew :D

[Rev]

Current status is that there is much much doubt if N caerulea has nuciferine in it

and analysis of this herbal drug indicates none either (excpt by duke 1992)

I dont think we know why ble lilly works so its very hard to say if the contain the same thing. in all liklihood - no, as they are not at all closely related

Dertwerver - nice hey definitely not a placebo but can be confused for it unless you eat lots or mix with acohol for a synergy

I like to pick the young ones and drink the nectar from inside dont try it when old as there may be bugs there! mmmm summer daze

Hebrew - nice find but plz people go easy on the ephedra. Technically they arent allowed to sell it like that, but they dont know this having been using it safely for several millennia who would blame them.

But lets not ruin it for them - a little goes a long way so dont get greedy

[hebrew]

reville wrote:

Hebrew - nice find but plz people go easy on the ephedra. Technically they arent allowed to sell it like that, but they dont know this having been using it safely for several millennia who would blame them.

But lets not ruin it for them - a little goes a long way so dont get greedy

good point

i got some for use as a herb when i have hayfever in spring i don't plan to be greedy

hebrew

[friendly]

I recently received 75g of Lotus stamens, the golden yellow, thin thread-like sexual organ of the flower.

These were smoked alone.

Results were very similar to smoked N. caerulea flowers but with a more calming quality overall; more like lotus than N. caerulea in that respect.

A very nice place to be.

Oils and tinctures are next.

Speaking of which: I have sen many depictions in Egyptian funerary art of people holding Blue Lily flowers over their noses.

These people are always said to be in mourning and the blue lily flower is supposed to produce forgetfulness of grief and suffering.

I recently came into some Blue Lily essential oil and was astounded to see people burst out laughing with big smiles on their faces after several inhalations.

I tried it on 50 people at the Telluride Mushroom Festival over three days and 47 of them had the same reaction without my saying anything. The other three were trying too hard to 'get it' and missed the whole thing.

Tentative Conclusion: The vapor of the essential oil of Nymphaea caerulea is psychoactive when inhaled.

I personally tried it and was amazed.

After several inhalations it seemed that my energy formed a vertical pillar around me and flowed down like a waterfall, spreading out and up when it reached the floor.

I found that, for me, the next day when all overt symptoms had dissipated, situations that would normally produce anxiety or stress failed to elicit any such response.

Without my saying anything to this effect several of the people who inhaled the vapors described their experiences in similar words.

Needless to say, I am seeking an essential oil extraction apparatus.

I now have Nymphaea ampla, M. mexicana, N. capensis, N. lotus and N. omarana to assay; they arrived while I was at Telluride.

I should be busy for quite a while to come. :cool:

[ 29. August 2004, 13:35: Message edited by: friendly ]

[Rev]

The smell out on the water in a lilly filled lagoon is intoxicating like a dream world

The fragrance, the Sweltering heat, the buzzing insects and humidity, the smell of the lagoon water. I said it earlier...summer daze

Once while intoxicatied on other euphoriant/Psychedelic combo, i found immense pleasure smelling the glass in which (a rather strong, perfumed and bitter brown) Fresh lilly Vodka extract had been made

The perfume was captured well by the vodka and the smell of the glass was pungent. Whenever i deeply inhaled the alcohol/lotus mix it was exhilarating

Another tincture whose aromatic effects had a definite effect was that of Rose

In particular a petal tincture of a fragrant re variety called 'Mr lincoln' (?)

Ive fed it to people who are totally stressed out or having anxiety attacks without their knowing (diluted in juice) and just watched them calm down so much in just 10 -15 mins

Id never have believed it myself if i hadnt done this blind test a few times

I suppose the cultural association with the Rose, love and hearts in European ethnobotany may have its roots in some recognised folk medicinal effect long before we made the connection purely symbolic.

The profile of constituents of Rose scent are extremely complex so i guess anything is possible

[John_Barleycorn]

Count me as another one who gets zip from lily in general (both nelumbo and nymphaea). I've steeped it in wine, smoked/vapourised it, smoked/vapourised alcohol extracts, smoked/vapourised seeds, you name it. Sources have included SAB, HHH, and Om Chi. Obviously, others are getting something out of it, so don't take that as a comment on any supplier. I am starting to wonder whether some liver enzyme is required for psychoactivity here. My test monkey can't demethylate codeine ...