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Chiral

AUSSIE Ayahuasca

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Anyone have a good Aya' recipe they wanna share. One where the ingredients are obtainable here locally and the amounts and procedures for preparation etc. There comes a point in their life where its time to learn such things and delve deeper.

edited for better wording.

Edited by Chiral

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wellcome to the forums!

it's a good idea to think localy, and it would be possible to brew aya with plants found growing in oz, however finding them would be quite some effort. peganum harmala grows wild and in abundance (introduced)in some parts of south australia, and accacias containing dmt can be found all over australia.

but i would not go this avenue, rather grow a caapi and viridis for a few years and take it from there.

having a long term relationship with those plants is very beneficial, to your seeking and might make all the difference to achive ones dreams.

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Hmmm nice yes I agree local would be best..as I sit hear waiting for my Viridis seedling to arrive I'm still on the hunt for a Caapi seedling/cutting or seed.

thanks for the welcome

I'm sure I will be here for many many years to come as I increase my knowledge of this wonderful community.

Edited by Chiral

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Hi there, I am also seeking the same thing, I have my psychotria viridis and now just need some advice on where i could possibly obtain caapi seedlings or seeds. I must say that I'm enjoying my plants thoroughly thus far and look forward to expanding my knowledge about them so any help would be much appreciated. Any aya recipes would be great also!!!

grantoss.

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if you want a caapi plant, have a look at the trade section of this forum, or order one from the shaman-australis online shop. caapi mostly get's probagated by cuttings, and rising this plant by seed is not so easy for a beginner...

about the aya recipes, we don't realy promote those here too much, after all there are lot's of forums soley devoted to aya wher you can read for hours about this subject. aswell we disscussed this issue here before and most people here were not keen on posts like, "i use 3 times as much viridis as poster X and twice as much caapi, i think you don't know what it means to drink a strong brew, bla, bla..."

in my opinon forget recepies, start of small and take it from there. another good trick is to cook the brew only slightly and/or for a short time.

forget dry leaves, the best brew's are made with super fresh material.

Edited by planthelper

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Is it really necessary to use acid in the brew? (ie lemon juice, vinegar, etc)

I am a little put off by the idea for a number of reasons..

1) It's not traditionaly used

2) It goes against the diet from what I can see, no acidic fruit, etc.

3) I think it would make the brew taste worse when reduced to a very concentrated form.

PS: I have heard that vinegar boils out and then heard others say that it doesn't so is this true?

Thanks.

Edited by baphomet

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you don't need the acid (as vinegar, ascorbic or lemos juice) but it might help to facilitate the uptake of the actives into the water. i guess lemon juice makes it only a bit easier to gulp down.

vinegar will boil out to a certain degree, but not totaly, some people even top up the vinegar over the hours of boiling which might take place.

late edit: was meant to say hours not hour!

Edited by planthelper

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My friend would like to avoid acid if possible.. Just doesn't feel right he says, but doesn't want a dud brew or to waste any of the viney leafy goodness. Is it really going to be wasteful not to use it?

Thanks again.

Edited by baphomet

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Once you start to read about other ways AYA" can be mixed and matched the possibilities appear endless.

Oh and you don't need any acid you can leach with cold water..in fact extreme temperature changes are good too..for those that are impatient..put in freezer then into boiling water, then into freezer and boiling water again, its much safer, nicer and no acid..or just soak it in water for a long time with lots of stirring and turning and you will get your product out ..its all got to do with patience.

I believe after speaking with a friend of mine who lives in Mexico that they simply use water and can tell when the product they are after has leached out by the colour of the water..its all about being with the vine and singing and paying attention. You have to consider too that the water they use has a completly different PH to ours. They Use ground water which is naturally more acidic than our processed tap water so the allready acid ground water is doing its job without additives. I kinda baulk and cringe at how we tend to bastardize old techniques with our way, and don't consider the finer details of how its done properly by real shamans with passed on recipes.

reading over these 2 links I have supplied makes for some interesting thoughts on prep etc..

these 2 links are very relative to Australia and its allways fun to read what others in other countries think of Aussies and what we do down under..LOL

http://dmt.tribe.net/thread/4272b52c-e306-...8b-29d635b81a82

http://forums.mycotopia.net/dmt-spice/1218...ear-changa.html

Edited by Chiral

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Funnily enough, brewing in the jungle appears highly inefficient in most cases. It's not what you would select to do at home on a stove, if that were legal. They just have heaps of material in the forest to work with :wub:

But there's a magic to it that is completely mystifying, that operates on a whole other level besides water and heat.

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I read somewhere that the water they get from the streams is between pH5 and pH6 which obviously aids in the brewing process.

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hunab has a thread on tap water..........acid or alkaline prob both work better than neutral.

try it and it should work ok,taste to test,try again adding acid if not happy.test residue by taste.

some times water is used for 2 runs and acid added only for a third.this third one could be added to the others or kept for separate use.

egg white clean up!!!!

t s t .

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i have caapi plants if ur looking, pm me

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I would prefer to use apple cider vinegar (theoretically of course, if I was in a country where legal) but that would go against the "dieta" and is probably contraindicated with MAOI's (?). I'm sure many of you are laughing right now and wouldn't give a shit about "la dieta" but I am a little superstitious when it comes to this sort of thing, I remember Jan Kounen (I hope I got his name right) saying in his documentary that he strayed from the diet once and felt like he was going schizophrenic for a week.

I have read on american forums that lemon juice is shit and one should use vinegar or phosphoric acid, anyone have a preference as to what type of acid to use?

Thanks

Edited by baphomet

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U could try LSD...

Edited by Chiral

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I would prefer to use apple cider vinegar (theoretically of course, if I was in a country where legal) but that would go against the "dieta" and is probably contraindicated with MAOI's (?).

There are many dietas followed. As an example, the one I follow involves no bananas. However, I have read about a plantain dieta where only bananas and small fish are eaten. I have never heard of any dietas which forbid vinegar though.

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herbalistics have Caapi plants availble for those who are looking!

Edited by misteek

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I have never heard of any dietas which forbid vinegar though.

As far as I know, the diet forbids anything fermented, I know apple cider vinegar is fermented and I guess white vinegar would be also.

It also forbids acidic fruits from what I have read so I just assumed it would go for all acid.

Is there a 'dieta' friendly way of doing this?

Thanks again.

Edited by baphomet

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Update..

My friend made a brew without any acid which blew him into orbit.

He also said that there was not the slightest hint of nausea, filtered it through a cut up t-shirt, got rid of almost all the sediment, probably had a lot to do with it.

He says that it did not taste bad at all really and can't understand why people whinge about the taste. Perhaps the sediment contains all the yucky stuff?

EDIT: please note, my friend lives in a country where it is legal to drink ayahuasca.

Edited by baphomet

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Update..

filtered it through a cut up t-shirt, got rid of almost all the sediment, probably had a lot to do with it.

He says that it did not taste bad at all really and can't understand why people whinge about the taste. Perhaps the sediment contains all the yucky stuff?

i find filtering a messy and a bit wastefull procedure, anyway i prefere to let the sediment settle and than, to carefully empty the vessel into another one leaving all the sediment behind... once you get to allmost the end of this procedure (and you are in danger of the sediment starting to move aswell) just halt the operation and let it re settle by placing it tilted onto another glass. like this you can rest the glass with keeping up exactly the same angle you had when you emptied the vessel.

naturaly that is not an option for the people in a rush.

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Filtering wasn't messy or wasteful really (from what I hear). He found a t-shirt with fine mesh (by holding it up to the light), he cut up a few pieces of cloth from this t-shirt and put them over a jug, then secured it around the opening with a rubber band, then made a funnel shaped depression in the cloth with his finger and poured the contents in a little bit at a time, he had to change the pieces of cloth a few times but it was no big deal, he then ringed out the pieces of cloth over a glass before discarding them, left in the cloth was a disgusting pile of red shit and he couldn't imagine drinking this, the thought horrifies him.

I can't see how this would be more wasteful as there would be some liquid left in the sediment that you discard surely? But after he had ringed out these little sections of cloth he says there was not much liquid left in them at all.

As far as time goes he did it with the final reduced brew and it took about 1/2 an hour to filter it, it was apparently a bit tedious changing the cloth but well worth it.

Re the taste, from what I hear it was fine, absolutely fine, almost no bitterness at all and no other bad taste so he is puzzled as to why people whinge so much about the taste and has concluded that it must be the stuff that gets filtered out that makes it taste so bad.

Also there was absolutely no nausea, so he assumes that this is also mostly related to the sediment?

Edited by baphomet

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i think the taste depends on how much raw material went into the brew and how much it got reduced to, and if the recepient uses sugar in there diet or not.

i know quite a few stories about people never experiencing nausea and only the occasional purgeing.

btw, i think the methode mentioned by hunab (cook 4 a while, than freeze, repeat) is a very good one.

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Yea I must have gone past his post, apparently in south america they often freeze viridis leaves before boiling them so that makes sense.

This friend of mine had frozen the remainder to make another wash with vinegar if it didn't work but luckily it did. It was soaking in water over a few days though so that would have helped with the extraction.

i think the taste depends on how much raw material went into the brew and how much it got reduced to, and if the recepient uses sugar in there diet or not.

There was plenty of raw material and it got reduced to half a small glass. It's not something you would go out of your way to drink for it's flavour apparently but it's not really unpleasant either (from what I hear). Apparently has very little bitterness compared to many other herbal extracts like ginko biloba and was one of the easiest herbal extracts he has ever had to drink, contrary to what he expected, which makes him wonder.. are the people whinging about the taste all just a bunch of pansies or is it because of the sediment that he filtered out?

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With sediment don't worry too much, and there really isn't a need to cloth filter..too many goodies get trapped..use the cold filtered technique. Get the brew down to about 1 litre, sediment an all and then pour it all into a nice glass jug and let sit in the fridge for a day. You will see the sediment all at the bottom now..cold filtered..and you can decant off the brew with good accuracy. continue to reduce very slowly to your desired amount and let sit till room temp and enjoy.

Edited by Chiral

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I have never heard of any dietas which forbid vinegar though.

As far as I know, the diet forbids anything fermented, I know apple cider vinegar is fermented and I guess white vinegar would be also.

That is a good point that I hadn't considered.

On the taste issue, some brews certainly taste better than others - of course it depends on which ingredients are used and the amounts, but apart from that I don't know why there is this difference.

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