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Coschi

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Stripping the lower half of the plant and leaving it to die is so ethical Coschi. I'm glad you are here to interpret what nature thinks you should do.

:BANGHEAD2::crux::BANGHEAD2::crux::BANGHEAD2:

:slap: :slap: :slap: :slap: :slap: :slap: :slap: :slap: :slap: :slap:

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isee what u mean apoth, but even maria sold out to the beatles lol i mean who can blame her shes only hooman, i think the human-ness alonside all these esoterical ramblings has a distinct beauty as well.and i agree with u at the same time.

the plants are for everyone who want to listen.

but yeah butchering plants i.e fuct up 'ringbarking' acacias is just fuken dumb.

dimitri-heads do the plants a favor, do a pruning module at the closest horticultural tafe.

cos kinda goes aginst what yas r tryin to achieve yeah? kinda like heres ur enlightenment at an environmental price. deadshits.

Edited by jono

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well it seems like im going against the grain of most opinions voiced here, but while it does look like the harvesting was done quite carelessly, shouldn't any real 'conservationist' worth his salt be more concerned about preserving our native forest and not encouraging the spread of a non-locally indigenous species?

word.

but.... u can still ethically remove wood from these trees keeping them alive, these trees grow fast, and maybee we would have a crop that crows endemically to the region that everyone can keep going back to if people use some simple pruning methods aside from ring barking?

i mean ur not gonna conserve a local specie by ringbarking it.

id rather smoke my ass than smoke anything that came by way of the ringbarking ideology.

its dumb.

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i'm not going to get into this :)

but if you're going to have a go at me, at least read what i wrote first apoth

i said pick a tree and take it, don't fuck with everyone you see

you have wooden furniture don't you?

have you honestly never taken something from nature?

if you ask me, it's there to be taken, but must be respected at the same time- something easily achieved

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I read what you wrote, all of it.

You didn't just pick a tree and take it, you picked a tree, damaged it in the worst possible way and left it to die. How does this show any respect whatsoever?

Wooden furniture isn't harvested from wild trees and certainly not by the method you used, and I definitely never took something from nature like you took this tree.

You can justify it however you like, but that thread shows your true colours. You don't even take your own advice, you killed a young tree (who knows how many you actually cut down) with many years to live, because you felt like a five hour drive justifies you to do as you please.

Those photos make me want to skin you from the waist down, wait till you die and then harvest all the good shit out of your body.

I'm with jono, I'd rather smoke dried flakes of my own shit than anything made like this. Made all the more disgusting by all your talk in the first post about "idiots taking bark" and respect for nature.

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hang on..... if these trees are not indiginous to that area and are in fact a weed and a pest to the local plant ecosystem...

well thats another ballgame. i guess just killin the tree leaves space for more weed to come up, but if the native seedbank is coming up.... but then again the dead tree would provide homes for wildlife maybee so i dunno... what ferret had to say is very valid. and thanks .

if this practice of ringbarking is used where the specie is endemic i.e lismore area,an the such, thats when i say learn how to prune if ya wanna take bark.

hpowever maybee dimitri heads r a godsend to areas where obtus may be getting a foothold in native forests it has become a weed in?

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Wooden furniture isn't harvested from wild trees

Usually it is actually, somewhere there is a great book about the Red Cedar harvested from the wild for its timber, so much so that it became very rare.

you killed a young tree (who knows how many you actually cut down) with many years to live,

he admitted he harvested 6 in that way, and that he intends to replace it with 6 baby seedlings (that might not survive) for the mature tree he took (come on, at least 2 seedlings per tree!)

just my 2 cents worth

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Wooden furniture isn't harvested from wild trees.

Its not?

I would have to disagree.

Im suprised by the comment mate, I thought you would have been right up on the whole Gunns pulp mill savegry in Tasmania

Plus most of this stuff does indeed go into higher end stuff like furniture, housing contruction materials or, unfortunatly even straight into the bloody chipper like Gunns is doing for paper and the like.

Its even going on right around you and all along our beautiful east cost.

For example

http://www.oren.org.au/logging/against.htm

http://www.wilderness.org.au/campaigns/for...;/nsw/climate3/

http://www.greenleft.org.au/1994/165/8544

This said, I dont agree with ring barking as a way to collect bark, I dont think the tree would appreciate being treated like that or the teacher that lives within.

IMO if you must take it, take it in one go.

Also, the idea of burning the wood to propagate the seeds, well, it sounds like a nice idea but could be asking for some real trouble, I think regen using seeds from that stand of trees would be the best way to go about it.

I suggestion would be to wait for some big storms next time and then go and collect fallen branches, bringing some hardend off seedlings with you?

Edited by AndyAmine.

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it's lots of effort (unless i have used a stupid method), but isn't scarifying meant to work on acacia seeds? i agree that burning is a huge risk, but i used to be a firebug i (vaguely) understand the dangers.

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jesus crucifixion is a bit harsh hey? :scratchhead:

these pagans sure get worked up.

seriously to me if this wood was collected in this method from an area where acacia obtusifolia is becoming a weed in i dont see that big a hooplah. a weeds a weed, and acacias can become the prerdominant specie fast to the detriment of the local plant ecology.

if was aweed in areawith good native seedstock coming up no harm done but would neva,eva do it in a local where obtus is endemic. could open up areas of disease etc that could spread and be bad as well i rekon.??

Edited by jono

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oh no man they're right, i'm a fucking cunt because i believe in something

i believe the plants are there to be taken, like magic mushrooms are there to be picked

i hear again and again that if you want to harvest trees you should grow them yourself. what's the fucking difference between harvesting a wild one or one of your own in the scheme of things? If anything the wild ones are the ones to be taken because they are a natural occurance of a psychedelic in nature; a psychedelic that nature wants you to see

i believe that taking a tree is not by any means disrespecting a plant teacher; i believe that respect is shown to them by what is done next

so yeah, i'm a fucking cunt

icon_king2.gif fuck you apoth, fuck you conan icon_king2.gif

-coschi out

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tool

  • Like 1

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i believe the plants are there to be taken, like magic mushrooms are there to be picked

yeah but u dont uproot the mycellium and kill it, or not tap outspore around the place,,or do u? cmon man

if u were serious about collecting for ur own use u could easily collect and keep the tree alive with simple pruning methods.

if ur doing that to trees in an endemic location for profit or dimitri hoarding ur a disgrace end of story.

kinda makes u no better then the said paper mill.

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lol ok, because you obviously know me so well

one more to the list, fuck you jono icon_king2.gif

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Jono, I'm not sure acacias really like pruning. You might find that you do more damage by pruning a dozen trees than by chopping down one or two.

Where I have seen acacia obtusifolia, they are definately weedy. They are coming up everywhere on the sides of the road. They are pushing each other over in some spots. There are draining channels where the grader has pushed over obtusifolias on the side of the road.

People get worked up about these plants because of what they contain. Then they make excuses for why it is okay for them to have wooden furniture and use paper. If killing a wild plant is wrong, then farming them and harvesting them is probably worse. If we are going to personify these plants, then we may imagine a human farm where humans are grown in large numbers for the sole purpose of slaughtering them for the use of their bodies. Doesn't that seem kind of worse?

It seems strange to me that people can post a thread about how they caught such and such fish, whacked it on the head, ripped its guts out, and fried it up and ate it. Then they get no response from the occasional vegetarian on these boards (who presumably think it is non of their business). Yet if someone posts about chopping down an acacia they get flamed. WTF?

My personal understanding of the world we live in hints at the likelyhood of plants being conscious to a degree, but it also suggests that atoms and galaxies are conscious. I think it is important for us to be ethical, but we can only be ethical within our anthropocentric framework. I don't know how to be ethical towards atoms and galaxies, and I don't know how I could avoid hurting trees, ants or bacteria. I think the most important thing is to do the very best that we know how, and I think most, if not all, in the ethnobotany community do that.

No shit it is stupid to ringbark trees for no reason. In most of these locations there are dead trees and trees falling over. But if you can't find any that have already had it, I don't see a problem in chopping down a few. More will spring up to take the place.

I think the overwhelming "don't harm obtusifolia in the wild" attitude on these forums is deceptive. I'm sure there are a lot out there who disagree but are afraid to post because they know they will get flamed. Those who do agree will post, and some who disagree will claim they agree. All this increases the appearance that it is the way everyone feels, and it makes people even more afraid to disagree.

Edited by ballzac
  • Like 1

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i read it and its crap. u can take a branch with a sharp blade on the correct andle, treat the wound if u may, and the tree will keep growing. trust me, ive pruned acacias from oround powerlines , roadworks,in landscaping etc, and there is a due method. if ringbarkings ur go its the wrong message. and god help the acacias this being a world wide web with prolly heaps of people reading asides us.

heaps of kids goin out ringbarkingacacias is detrimental, i think be responsible ballzac all im sayin man.

i mean look what happened to lophs and arios in their native environment from poor collection techniques.

anyways if its a weed in a forest as i said its a different ballgame im entitled to my opinion and so is cochi, its just not a sustainable harvesting technique capeche.

Edited by jono

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u can take a branch with a sharp blade on the correct andle, treat the wound if u may, and the tree will keep growing. trust me, ive pruned acacias from oround powerlines , roadworks,in landscaping etc, and there is a due method.

I stand corrected. I had read that acacias were difficult to prune successfully, but I probably read too much into it

and god help the acacias this being a world wide web with prolly heaps of people reading asides us.

heaps of kids goin out ringbarkingacacias is detrimental

I agree, and I certainly didn't include said kids when I claimed that the ethnobotany community is generally responsible about it. But, I think these people that don't do it properly won't have much luck doing an extraction either, and they will get discouraged quickly. If they are persistent enough, they will do more research and they will find out how frowned upon ringbarking and other wasteful techniques are. All in all though, I don't think it is a plant for which much of this stuff matters. It may even be beneficial to kill a few and give the eucalypts a chance. Of course, most people I know simply try to avoid making too much of an impact, and I think that is a healthy attitude to have.

Edited by ballzac

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If they are persistent enough, they will do more research and they will find out how frowned upon ringbarking and other wasteful techniques are

I have ringbarked trees as i'm sure others have too, but like Ballzac's comment here, the same things i realised as others have and have for significant time changed my approach. i mention this so you can stop your associations with me and ringbarking of trees

fyi the current quota is 11, so 33 will be returned with maintenance

--although to this i suggest that I am introducing a weed to an area where it doesn't belong (i would introduce them more locally rather than the area in which they are - 5 hours drive a apoth mentioned isn't actually maintainable) but I guess you people must think i'd be a fucking stupid selfish drug feind fool to do something like plant a tree where it is declared a weed.. granted yes i am exactly that since you all know me so fucking well

also, as ballzac mentioned these acacias do tend to take over an area and act as weeds. Even in an area where the oldest tree was well under 10 years old there were at least thirty 50cm tall ones also. So if you find a well established area and remove one or two trees for the purpose which we all know of, really it is not that big a deal; and to follow that like i said if you do the next steps wisely and respectfully i have full faith that the plant teachers would be smiling

if ur doing that to trees in an endemic location for profit or dimitri hoarding ur a disgrace end of story

Jono, about a year ago spice found me, i had the pleasure of seeing the other side before i even knew the first thing about it. instantly i'd almost say i'd devote my life to this, because i feel it's something people need to see to put their lives in a little perspective. if you did know me you'd know that i haven't taken spice in a significantly long time, even though it is always there, and i would NEVER under any circumstances no matter what my situation be in this for profit. It's a persuit of mine to show people what's there so in future try not to make such assumptions about people you don't know a single thing about

Those photos make me want to skin you from the waist down, wait till you die and then harvest all the good shit out of your body.

I'm with jono, I'd rather smoke dried flakes of my own shit than anything made like this. Made all the more disgusting by all your talk in the first post about "idiots taking bark" and respect for nature.

apothecary, i've said it before and i'll say it again; GO FUCK YOURSELF

there are some good people here at SAB, and unfortunatly some real fucking dicks too

Edited by Coschi

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Forget the ring barking guy's

Watching the news earlier on this evening, i heard that the fire season is in full swing now after the rain over christmas time ( it pissed down in vic!!) and the Bendoc area of east gippy (probably near the spot where coschi got his pics) is starting to burn as well as other areas, could be the start of a big one -

Fire can threaten parts of east gippy every few years and unless the area has had a burn off over the last decade a fair bit of fuel can gather, Obtuse is some of the fuel!

If those damn ring barking trippers don't kill em, fire will,

I'd just hate to be an Acacia, get your bark ripped off, then burn to death

I reckon fire would bring life to many more??? Is this wishfull thinking,

Has any one tried to grow one in a garden in metro melboune??? If so how did it go?_ anyone?

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no doubt ringbarking trees would lessen the firehazard, i mean more dead timber for the burn, :rolleyes:

i stand by my statement,ringbarking is a foolish and irresponsible means for gathering acacia bark(where the population is endemic) :blink:

i would never,ever under ANY circumstances ringbark a tree. (well maybbe to take out a pest tree but there are better methods for doing this. As a matter of fact is one reason why i wont smoke dmtcrystal, as ive seen themoronic destruction of ecosytems so called 'at one with the universe' folks do in pursuit of bark.

but then again once u have a god complex who gives a fuk ay? its all about YOU!!

ahem wise words spoken to me once "Its not all about you"

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ahem wise words spoken to me once "Its not all about you"

Wise words sang to me once: "There is no you there is only me, there is no you there is only me, there's no fucking you there is only me..."

umm... So there is no you, therefore it must be all about me :D

anyway egotrip aside, ...i have nothing constructive to add. ringbarking is bad mmmkay.

just prune the fuckers, int there plenty of goodness in the phyllodes and flowers anyway? that's sustainable at least.

This has some interesting information, there's Mescaline and other assorted phenethylamines, beta-carbolines, nicotine and so forth in a few of these, like Acacia berlandieri.

[edit]might be bullshit, it is wikipedia after all.

Edited by El Duderino

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Destruction of ecosystems due to ringbarking?

Must be a popular pursuit in some parts, NOT DOWN HERE

Rarely and i mean very rarely does this sort of thing happen in VIC

Despite the fact it grows like a sweet Pittosporum (P phylliraeoides?) Acacia obtuse- 'local useless weed most of the time' (freakin everywhere in those hills it is in east gippy to stay

Whats dmtcrystal???

Far east Gippsland is a truly unique and magical location, known to my family for 4 generations now

cheers

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