E. novogranatense availability.

[sobriquet]

Hello all,

This is a plant I've wanted for some time though I haven't been pro-active in trying to find it until now. I know its legal status and that aspect doesn't need discussion. I'm just interested in firstly getting seeds (which I'm aware are short lived) or rooted cuttings.

I've tried the international avenue that has been discussed here before and they appear to be inactive and have not responded to emails.

While I'm happy with the idea of capitalism & commerce, this is just an interest of mine and I don't want to pay excessively for these from someone local. I know if I had some specimens then I'd be happy to share these. The only way forward is for this plant to become more available locally and even escape to the wild through deliberate plantings and natural bird movement type spread.

So any help in obtaining these would be greatly appreciated. Please PM or email me any details.

Cheers.

[MORG]

I know its legal status and that aspect doesn't need discussion.

The only way forward is for this plant to become more available locally and even escape to the wild through deliberate plantings and natural bird movement type spread.

Duck and cover dude.

I won't discuss legality cos you're not interested but I'm sure others will.

Escape to the wild is an environmental travesty and I hope this never happens.

[occidentalis]

ROTFL

That must be close to the best first post I've seen

"I am looking for a rare and illegal plant. I would like to be given it for free. I intend to aid its establishment as an environmental weed".

Edited July 31, 2006 by creach

[sobriquet]

Duck and cover dude.

I won't discuss legality cos you're not interested but I'm sure others will.

Escape to the wild is an environmental travesty and I hope this never happens.

The truth is that Australia is full of introduced species. Driving up and down the Pacific highway you see thousands of escaped Radiata pines and other introduced bushes. I honestly can't see why this plant would be any different in terms of its impact. Maybe people are worried about Koalas not sleeping 18+ hours ;)

[Dodie]

Do you know what the definition of a "weed" is?

[sobriquet]

ROTFL

That must be close to the best first post I've seen

"I am looking for a rare and illegal plant. I would like to be given it for free. I intend to aid its establishment as an environmental weed".

I'm all for healthy capitalism, so I'm prepared to reward anyone for their help.

The primary aim is to make it more available to those who want it. I buy plants all the time and realise the time and effort that goes into growing them and keeping them healthy so I have no problems with people expecting adequate compensation for that.

Anyhow, the philosophical and legal sides will always be controversial.

Again any help would be greatly appreciated and rewarded.

Cheers.

[Tripitaka]

I have several acres of Ephedra that I have just harvested!

Would anyone have any glassware that I could borrow to make some amphetamine for the local school kids??

Please come on, I will clean it when I'm finished and post it back together with a sample of the finished product.

[occidentalis]

The primary aim is to make it more available to those who want it. I buy plants all the time and realise the time and effort that goes into growing them and keeping them healthy so I have no problems with people expecting adequate compensation for that.

I appreciate that - I was just laying it on thick for entertainment value.

[naja naja]

I have several acres of Ephedra that I have just harvested!

Would anyone have any glassware that I could borrow to make some amphetamine for the local school kids??

Please come on, I will clean it when I'm finished and post it back together with a sample of the finished product.

Edited October 17, 2007 by naja naja

[sobriquet]

I appreciate that - I was just laying it on thick for entertainment value.

That's cool.

I've read past posts and have hit a dead end for the time being. So can anyone steer me in the right direction here?

Thanks in advance.

[Legba]

So can anyone steer me in the right direction here?

there are plenty of legal ethnobotanicals to choose from. i'd suggest u start by growing them.

[planthelper]

hmm, topicstarter don't take that personel, but there is a high chance that you will not suceed in growing this plant, so your promise of giving back is very unrealistic.

in the field of ethnobotany you have to be patient and make a name for youreselfe by having a couple of posts down your belt, once you get well known, many things can happen...

[sobriquet]

there are plenty of legal ethnobotanicals to choose from. i'd suggest u start by growing them.

Hi Bacchant. It's a fair suggestion. I started in this quite a while back and have had my fair share of experience with a variety of things. Started with growing my own hemp and even though I never grew them onto buds, the leaves and tips of the plants I did grow blew away any and all of any commercial stuff I'd ever smoked.

I grew my own poppies shortly after. I grew about 20 plants starting from a supermarket poppy packet that had thousands of seeds and they grew into white poppies with purple bases. I collected enough opium that when I had dried and processed it by boiling and filtering I had about half a medicine cup full of powdered smokable opium. I used that up over 9 months in what were very enjoyable sessions.

Since then I've been growing khat and some peyote. The khat plant has reached waist height from a single cutting and has self layered itself into 3 more plants besides the first. Unfortunately I don't like the powdery taste from the young leaves to really enjoy it. It's also hit and miss regarding their activity. Some months it will be very strong and others it's a waste of time. The peyote is something I'm hoping will be big enough after a few years to become something I can enjoy over a summer.

I stopped smoking several years ago and don't want to smoke any other botanicals etc.

Some of the best experiences for me though was with pharmaceuticals. I've experienced the pleasure of doing 1 gram of pure uncut cocaine over a weekend. But it was pure fluff. Nothing learned from it at all. The king in that regard was ketamine. My experience with that went over several months and the insights I got into the world and the universe through that were profound. I went into it a pure psychonaut. Someone wanting the thrill of a trip and came out a different person who saw things in a different way. I know it sounds cliched, but when you actually fly over cities of the world and come back from each experience with a tentative grip on some otherwise incomprehensible truths it affects you in deep ways.

Along the way I've developed an interest in bonsai and growing plants and my interest in the E novo stems from that as much as anything else.

Cheers.

[sobriquet]

hmm, topicstarter don't take that personel, but there is a high chance that you will not suceed in growing this plant, so your promise of giving back is very unrealistic.

in the field of ethnobotany you have to be patient and make a name for youreselfe by having a couple of posts down your belt, once you get well known, many things can happen...

Hi planthelper. I've been growing bonsai for over ten years and am experienced with plant care though I have much still to learn.

And yes I understand what you are saying my friend and hope to contribute more here and enjoy learning from you all.

Cheers.

[elzar]

I once had a romantic idea of bringing this one to my garden. I looked at the laws and then at the ability to get the plant. In the end i realised that the trouble of growing and obtaining this plant far outweighed the dream. In the end there are many better plants to focus my energy on.

on another note, just because Australia is full of weeds doesnt mean it needs more.

[sobriquet]

I once had a romantic idea of bringing this one to my garden. I looked at the laws and then at the ability to get the plant. In the end i realised that the trouble of growing and obtaining this plant far outweighed the dream. In the end there are many better plants to focus my energy on.

on another note, just because Australia is full of weeds doesnt mean it needs more.

In relation to weeds, as above the definition of 'weed' is a difficult one. There have been disastrous plant introductions in Australia like the well known prickly pear etc. but compared to the shear number of introduced species (in the hundreds of thousands) the number that become severe problems is quite few by comparison. I mean even the common European olive tree and some pines which are commercially grown are classified 'weeds' but they are not severely invasive or destructive and nor are they noxious.

As far as legality goes. If you were growing only this plant then you could have some troubles explaining things if you were discovered and had some other 'fun' plants and a stack of High Times magazines. But if you have this growing in a veritable garden oasis then I would bet you that no visitor would even recognise the plant amongst all the others. I'd almost bet that in Australia you could almost grow it as a hedge and no one would know or care. Well maybe not as your front hedge anyhow

[elzar]

from that point i agree you may even be able to have the police around for a BBQ and they would just comment on how well the hedge is doing. possibly through fear and paranoia the legal system works on me to a degree. Still i would rather a Khat hedge and maybe a coffe plantation at the end of the day.

[occidentalis]

There have been disastrous plant introductions in Australia like the well known prickly pear etc. but compared to the shear number of introduced species (in the hundreds of thousands) the number that become severe problems is quite few by comparison.

It's around 10% of introductions. And I think the number of introductions would be measured in 10s of 1000s rather than 100s of 1000s.

I mean even the common European olive tree and some pines which are commercially grown are classified 'weeds' but they are not severely invasive or destructive and nor are they noxious.

This issue has been discussed in great detail here before. Australia is a big place and many plants will have the opportunity to become weeds in at least one of its ecosystems. However, there are some plants which have biological characteristics that predispose them to being more strongly weedy than others. I don't know enough about the biology of E novo to decide whether or not it would fall into this category. Olives and pines are problems in some parts of WA.

[sobriquet]

It's around 10% of introductions. And I think the number of introductions would be measured in 10s of 1000s rather than 100s of 1000s.

This issue has been discussed in great detail here before. Australia is a big place and many plants will have the opportunity to become weeds in at least one of its ecosystems. However, there are some plants which have biological characteristics that predispose them to being more strongly weedy than others. I don't know enough about the biology of E novo to decide whether or not it would fall into this category. Olives and pines are problems in some parts of WA.

Yes you are quite right.

More than 27,000 species of alien plants have been introduced to Australia since European colonisation, with new species being introduced every year. About 10 per cent of introduced species become naturalised in their new habitat, meaning they can maintain their populations in the wild without human cultivation. One in ten naturalised plants become weeds, and have a negative impact on native biodiversity, agriculture, or both. The price paid for species which become weeds is tremendous, both in economic and environmental terms.

from http://www.science.org.au/nova/099/099key.htm

So 2700 are naturalised meaning they can grow and propagate itself in the wild. And therefore that 270 are weeds that have negative impact on Australia.

So this indicates a rate of about 1% becoming pests. Quite small compared to the number introduced. Based purely on these numbers as probability values the chances of any one introduction becoming a weed is quite low.

And while I agree that the 1% that are pests constitutes a great price, on the other side of the equation is the enormous economic gain and benefit from some of these 'weeds' like radiata pine, without which Australia's housing industry would suffer.

As with everything, there's plusses and minusses. Nevertheless your point is taken

Cheers.

[Torsten]

Because of the legal situation we live in we give a certain leeway to people who want to incriminate themselves, however we do not tolerate people who ask others to break laws.

This species is not just kinda somewhat prohibited, but it is fully scheduled as a prohibited drug plant. Getting busted with 1 E.n. plant is the same as getting busted with 1 Cannabis plant. The judge makes no distinction. And you can't *always* count on the stupidity of the cops.

E.n. plants are quite common in FNQ and some have been busted, so some of the cops up there would be quite aware of them. If you want to take the risk of growing them then that is fine. You may one day be offered some seed by someone (regardless of whether they are in this community or not), but it is not OK to ask for something illegal on these forums. You may as well be asking for a cannabis plant or even a gram of heroin. Makes no difference to the law. And if someone supplies this plant then they are also a drug supplier under the law and hence you are asking people to break the drug law with your request (yes, 'supply' is a separate charge to 'possession').

As such even if someone here has this species, I doubt they will provide you with much help.

As for weeds, E.N does not have weed potential anywhere in oz except in the wet tropics as far as I can ascertain. I would rate it about the same as coffee in weed potential as long as birds don't take a liking to the berries, which I don't think they have. The only difference between E.n. and coffee is that E.n. prefers it warmer and won't tolerate the tablelands/NNSW climate too well. It does love cairns though.

[sobriquet]

Because of the legal situation we live in we give a certain leeway to people who want to incriminate themselves, however we do not tolerate people who ask others to break laws.

This species is not just kinda somewhat prohibited, but it is fully scheduled as a prohibited drug plant. Getting busted with 1 E.n. plant is the same as getting busted with 1 Cannabis plant. The judge makes no distinction. And you can't *always* count on the stupidity of the cops.

E.n. plants are quite common in FNQ and some have been busted, so some of the cops up there would be quite aware of them. If you want to take the risk of growing them then that is fine. You may one day be offered some seed by someone (regardless of whether they are in this community or not), but it is not OK to ask for something illegal on these forums. You may as well be asking for a cannabis plant or even a gram of heroin. Makes no difference to the law. And if someone supplies this plant then they are also a drug supplier under the law and hence you are asking people to break the drug law with your request (yes, 'supply' is a separate charge to 'possession').

As such even if someone here has this species, I doubt they will provide you with much help.

As for weeds, E.N does not have weed potential anywhere in oz except in the wet tropics as far as I can ascertain. I would rate it about the same as coffee in weed potential as long as birds don't take a liking to the berries, which I don't think they have. The only difference between E.n. and coffee is that E.n. prefers it warmer and won't tolerate the tablelands/NNSW climate too well. It does love cairns though.

Hi Torsten. I understand. I should have made it clearer that the request was in relation to the informational aspect rather than a request for supply. So I apologise profusely for not being clearer. I think one of my later posts makes it more clear when I simply asked to be steered in the right direction.

Cheers.

[MORG]

I've been growing bonsai for over ten years and am experienced with plant care though I have much still to learn.

I'd love to see some bonsai pics if you ever feel like sharing.

[sobriquet]

I'd love to see some bonsai pics if you ever feel like sharing.

While I'd have no problem posting pics of other amorphous plants and trees, I'd be hesitant to post pictures of my bonsais because they are distinctive and only very slowly changing and they could be used to identify me especially if I posted pics of the same tree on another forum or website.

Especially with posts such as the one here I'd be wanting to remain out of reach of unwanted interest if you understand what I mean.

Cheers.

[Jesus On Peyote]

A very welcoming community we have here...and seeing as everyone was a jackass about his questain maybe if he theoryeticly gets such a plant he wont be so helpfull to others begging for its blessings

[Μορφέας]

seek the dance and u wil find!

Edited April 2, 2007 by tepa